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Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

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Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#131

Post by altairprime »

salmonellaeater wrote: post #31

> Individual servers would let different groups set their own community standards, though likely with a “floor” of rules set by Meta, in a fashion similar to how Reddit’s individual communities work. This is not praise. Reddit bans people for expressing widely held beliefs. Subreddit mods are required to enforce the site-wide rules regardless of the subreddit's own preferences. As another commenter put it [1], the pr…

That same property of inviolable non-excludable makes a social network inaccessible to those who are frequently harassed. The right to shun some participants is a necessary function of social spaces, to mitigate known and documented human tendencies over the past couple thousand years to drown out, abuse, and in general commit conversational warfare upon others.

“Just block them” doesn’t scale when each harasser is harassing thousands of people. “Just block scripts” is no more effective than blocking adblockers. “Opt-in moderators” is no more legally viable than “No moderators”.

If you want to moderate a space, then set up and run a space of your own. If you want to federate with others, you’ll comply with the moderation requirements of your federations. If you want your space to stay online, you’ll comply with the moderation requirements of your hosting and transit providers. If you want your federation to stay online, you’ll comply with the moderation requirements of your organization’s laws. This is true today for all social sites, whether solo or distributed.

Facebook thinks they can opt out of expensive and difficult moderation duties by transferring the legal requirements for moderation to their users. They may succeed briefly, but the EU will not look kindly upon their attempt to circumvent the law.

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#132

Post by js8 »

melling wrote: post #115
mym1990 wrote: post #83

What if, and hear me out: we ditch the idea of a better replacement social network and just ditch the concept in general? Let’s go back to not being bombarded by ads every 3rd post, to not getting lost in massive echo chambers, to not doom scrolling for 20-40% of our waking hours, being locked into mega platforms, etc... Is the proposition of “being more connected” really worth the downsides?

[Successful] Companies build what consumers want. You aren’t locked into social networks. Don’t use them. Consumers vote with their dollars. The constant noise of “Paywall” is why so much is ad based. So, if you’ve got a better idea, build it and see if they come. [Updated] Clarified that I meant successful companies.

> Companies build what consumers want.

Note how circular this is. You say "consumers", not people. Who is a consumer is also defined by said companies.

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#133

Post by yalogin »

Why is this obsession with decentralized? I don’t see the benefits of it at all. A central server is better if they have a good moderation plan built in. This whole decentralized idea is to wash their hands off moderation and not take a blame for the hellhole it will become. From a pure functional point of view, how can a decentralized network provide any performance guarantee? What am I missing?

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#134

Post by nonethewiser »

gonzo41 wrote: post #69
salmonellaeater wrote: post #31

> Individual servers would let different groups set their own community standards, though likely with a “floor” of rules set by Meta, in a fashion similar to how Reddit’s individual communities work. This is not praise. Reddit bans people for expressing widely held beliefs. Subreddit mods are required to enforce the site-wide rules regardless of the subreddit's own preferences. As another commenter put it [1], the pr…

You see mods on reddit go on ego trip ban spree's all the time. It's classic 90's mod meltdown stuff. I don't think subscribing to a benevolent master is a good model. What happens if their gaze turns to you? Moderation is really hard. And it's especially hard because a lot of people have very para-social relationships between themselves and rando's they talk to online. Whilst I know that sometimes those rando's turn…

> You see mods on reddit go on ego trip ban spree's all the time. It's classic 90's mod meltdown stuff. I don't think subscribing to a benevolent master is a good model. What happens if their gaze turns to you?

Unsubscribe

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#136

Post by [deleted] »

melling wrote: post #115
mym1990 wrote: post #83

What if, and hear me out: we ditch the idea of a better replacement social network and just ditch the concept in general? Let’s go back to not being bombarded by ads every 3rd post, to not getting lost in massive echo chambers, to not doom scrolling for 20-40% of our waking hours, being locked into mega platforms, etc... Is the proposition of “being more connected” really worth the downsides?

[Successful] Companies build what consumers want. You aren’t locked into social networks. Don’t use them. Consumers vote with their dollars. The constant noise of “Paywall” is why so much is ad based. So, if you’ve got a better idea, build it and see if they come. [Updated] Clarified that I meant successful companies.

[deleted]

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#137

Post by nonethewiser »

papito wrote: post #37
salmonellaeater wrote: post #31

> Individual servers would let different groups set their own community standards, though likely with a “floor” of rules set by Meta, in a fashion similar to how Reddit’s individual communities work. This is not praise. Reddit bans people for expressing widely held beliefs. Subreddit mods are required to enforce the site-wide rules regardless of the subreddit's own preferences. As another commenter put it [1], the pr…

Just because over 10 million Americans believe that Tom Hanks violates, kills, and eats children - a widely held belief - does not mean that a private company can't tell those people to go suck a bug. A private company does moderation and it's the end of the world. Ron DeSantis bans books and he is just "anti-woke". The actual government.

I have never heard of this “widely held belief”.

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#138

Post by OgAstorga »

melling wrote: post #115
mym1990 wrote: post #83

What if, and hear me out: we ditch the idea of a better replacement social network and just ditch the concept in general? Let’s go back to not being bombarded by ads every 3rd post, to not getting lost in massive echo chambers, to not doom scrolling for 20-40% of our waking hours, being locked into mega platforms, etc... Is the proposition of “being more connected” really worth the downsides?

[Successful] Companies build what consumers want. You aren’t locked into social networks. Don’t use them. Consumers vote with their dollars. The constant noise of “Paywall” is why so much is ad based. So, if you’ve got a better idea, build it and see if they come. [Updated] Clarified that I meant successful companies.

Companies build what consumers want.

You aren’t locked into Heroin. Don’t use it.

Consumers vote with their dollars.

So, if you’ve got a better idea, synthesize it and see if they come.

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#139

Post by swayvil »

yalogin wrote: post #133

Why is this obsession with decentralized? I don’t see the benefits of it at all. A central server is better if they have a good moderation plan built in. This whole decentralized idea is to wash their hands off moderation and not take a blame for the hellhole it will become. From a pure functional point of view, how can a decentralized network provide any performance guarantee? What am I missing?

A central authority that has total control over the conversation is considered by many to be a bad thing. Some think that a more democratic approach is preferable.

Re: Meta is building a decentralized, text-based social network

#140

Post by plorg »

xeeeeeeeeeeenu wrote: post #26
plorg wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember when Facebook (and Google, etc.) supported federated XMPP? I can't bring myself to expect any different outcome this time.

>Remember when Facebook (and Google, etc.) supported federated XMPP? Facebook's XMPP server wasn't federated. You couldn't use it to talk to people on other servers.

Thank you, I must have misremembered.
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