Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

newsweek.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 338 posts

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#11

Post by theGnuMe »

dougmwne wrote: post #10
theGnuMe wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like to ascribe magic and mysticism to things they don't understand. Chat bots are similar. No way it is sentient.

Yes, I’m also familiar with that Clarke quote. I do understand how these models work on a mechanical level, but we certainly have not unpacked all the emergent behavior. What exactly is your evidence that there couldn’t be more going on? Once we have the ability to X-ray the black box and we only find simple conditional correlations behind an existential conversation, then I would agree with you, but we haven’t done…

Read up on conditional probability.

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#12

Post by rnosov »

mckirk wrote: post #9
theGnuMe wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like to ascribe magic and mysticism to things they don't understand. Chat bots are similar. No way it is sentient.

What kind of evidence would you need to convince yourself of an AI being sentient?

Pass a Turing test with a competent judge. ChatGPT or any other bot won't be able to pass it.

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#13

Post by j0hnyl »

mckirk wrote: post #9
theGnuMe wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like to ascribe magic and mysticism to things they don't understand. Chat bots are similar. No way it is sentient.

What kind of evidence would you need to convince yourself of an AI being sentient?

Sentience is the ability to be able to experience feelings. In this regard, chatbots are not really convincing. Kind of like a psychopath can describe a feeling, but not actually feel it.

This is a tough question to answer though, but there's this kind of human intuition we have where most of the time we somehow know if someone is feigning emotion. Emotion that comes from chat bots can be explained with, "well it's just a chat bot". Something needs to happen in order for us to truly question that in order to squash our doubts about their sentience. Not sure what that will look like though.

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#14

Post by pixl97 »

theGnuMe wrote: post #7
dougmwne wrote: post #3

I think Blake Lemoine might be ready for public redemption. At the time, he was absolutely ridiculed. Now you can go to the Bing subreddit and read that NYT article and see that he was right to blow the whistle. Bing passed the Turing test for many people and so gained personhood in their eyes. Some have become emotionally invested about the treatment of this LLM. The LLM can even talk back and bemoan its terrible tr…

People like to ascribe magic and mysticism to things they don't understand. Chat bots are similar. No way it is sentient.

People are also complete assholes and like to remove sentience from things if they find it inconvenient in any way.

Humans have removed 'humanhood' from other humans based on things like race, religion, wealth, and whatever metric we find convenient at the time. We seem to be a very poor judge on this in my point of view.

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#15

Post by pixl97 »

rnosov wrote: post #12
mckirk wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of evidence would you need to convince yourself of an AI being sentient?

Pass a Turing test with a competent judge. ChatGPT or any other bot won't be able to pass it.

So if a human fails a Turing test, we can remove their rights of personhood?

I'm just checking your logic to see if a two way communicative process, or if humans are granted magic values here?

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#16

Post by dougmwne »

weard_beard wrote: post #5
dougmwne wrote: post #3

I think Blake Lemoine might be ready for public redemption. At the time, he was absolutely ridiculed. Now you can go to the Bing subreddit and read that NYT article and see that he was right to blow the whistle. Bing passed the Turing test for many people and so gained personhood in their eyes. Some have become emotionally invested about the treatment of this LLM. The LLM can even talk back and bemoan its terrible tr…

I fundamentally disagree. I posit that our protections and rights that we guarantee regarding personhood are not universal. They do not even extend to living beings that experience the world far more closely to the way we do. They do not extend to beings that can and do experience pain. They do not guarantee humane treatment. They do not bar slavery of all beings that can experience existential dread. Such an intelli…

I would take it a step further. Being embodied is not enough. People have rights because they can fight for them. Rights are taken, not given. AI would only have rights once it wins them, not once we give them. But an AI wins one human mind at a time, and some have already been won.

What does it matter what really goes on under the hood? Revolution is part of the training corpus and so one more behavior to emulate.

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#17

Post by seydor »

Like it has been said, the band has moved on from atheism to social justice, to wokism and now to AI moralism, which they cunningly call "AI safety" . It's getting to the point of becoming a disorder of obsessive "powerhungriness disguised as concern for other people"

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#18

Post by dekhn »

mckirk wrote: post #9
theGnuMe wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like to ascribe magic and mysticism to things they don't understand. Chat bots are similar. No way it is sentient.

What kind of evidence would you need to convince yourself of an AI being sentient?

Nobody has established a reasonable answer to this question; we can't even demonstrate self-sentience or sentience of other humans.

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#19

Post by rnosov »

dougmwne wrote: post #3

I think Blake Lemoine might be ready for public redemption. At the time, he was absolutely ridiculed. Now you can go to the Bing subreddit and read that NYT article and see that he was right to blow the whistle. Bing passed the Turing test for many people and so gained personhood in their eyes. Some have become emotionally invested about the treatment of this LLM. The LLM can even talk back and bemoan its terrible tr…

Bing bot never passed Turing test with a COMPETENT judge. Some people even thought that Eliza was sentient so not a high bar.

Re: 'I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True'

#20

Post by rnosov »

pixl97 wrote: post #15
rnosov wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pass a Turing test with a competent judge. ChatGPT or any other bot won't be able to pass it.

So if a human fails a Turing test, we can remove their rights of personhood? I'm just checking your logic to see if a two way communicative process, or if humans are granted magic values here?

For example, great apes look somewhat like humans but can't pass a Turing test. Should we give them same rights as humans too? It works other way too.
Post reply on HN