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Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

theguardian.com

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Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#351

Post by zamnos »

ali7388 wrote: post #44
dogma1138 wrote: post #28

Not they haven’t this phone isn’t anymore repairable than an iPhone it might be just a bit more serviceable. Users can’t do board or component level repairs, and Nokia isn’t making schematics, diagnostic software and access to low level firmware that will be needed to independently repair this phone available. User replaceable battery is nice, however every other component is reliant on a supply on parts being made a…

Users can order cheap parts from china just fine. The problem is with manufacturers. Encrypting parts, so simple part swap does not work. Or replacement screen for $300... Apple is really really bad when it comes to repairability!

"Encrypting" parts also has to do with the black market for iPhones. If you steal someone's iPhone, they can brick it remotely, so you can't just resell it as a whole working device, so you part it out to a shady cell phone repair store who will reuse the parts and give you like fifty bucks so you can score your next bag of drugs. By embedding serial numbers on the parts, Apple stops this and makes the parts unusable, driving down the value of a stolen iPhone.

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#352

Post by tomrod »

jimnotgym wrote: post #162

Wow HN. I really interesting new product comes out, a really interesting turn in the right to repair debate, and a return of a famous brand. And instead of talking about that, there are a series of threads about how an iphone costing 5 times as much and is famously difficult to repair is a better phone than this. Get a grip! Can we not have a least one conversation without Apple fanbois wading in?

> one conversation without Apple fanbois wading in?

Aye. Almost like we shouldn't have a conversation about Android without mentioning the spyware and telemetry that both Android and IOS collect being more than enough reason to use Purism and other open alternatives.

#stallman_was_right

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#353

Post by tomComb »

uallo wrote: post #323
tomComb wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That just refers to the security updates that require a full firmware update. I think people get focussed on that because they’re used to the iPhone where that’s only way to fix security issues. On android, the majority of security issues are patched immediately and silently through the play store, so that continues pretty much for the life of the phone. In other words, updates are much less important on android than…

> so that continues pretty much for the life of the phone. I'm on a Pixel 1 with Android 10. Last security update it got was from October 2019 which is about three years after the phone was introduced. Is this supposed to be different on newer Android versions?

That refers to the formal (full firmware) updates, I'm talking about security updates that get pushed to the phone without you having to do anything.

It started with the browser component many years ago, and has grown its coverage with each version. The limitations are mainly in the kernel, but they now even do graphics drivers this way (though that requires vendor cooperation, unlike everything else), but you wouldn't have that with Android 10.

This capability has steadily grown to cover more of the OS over time, particularly recently, so unfortunately, Yes, Android 10 does have much less of this ability then later versions.

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#354

Post by tomrod »

mlinksva wrote: post #186
jimnotgym wrote: post #162

Wow HN. I really interesting new product comes out, a really interesting turn in the right to repair debate, and a return of a famous brand. And instead of talking about that, there are a series of threads about how an iphone costing 5 times as much and is famously difficult to repair is a better phone than this. Get a grip! Can we not have a least one conversation without Apple fanbois wading in?

The positive (and there's plenty of criticism; search and read) point being made about iphone is that it has a longer support duration. This seems highly complementary to repairability -- both seem important to maximize useful life -- and thus an entirely fair point, no? I'm recently on my 4th Android smartphone in 12 years (Galaxy S, Moto G, Pixel 2, Pixel 7) and would be still on the Pixel 2 if not for lack of upda…

> This seems highly complementary to repairability -- both seem important to maximize useful life -- and thus an entirely fair point, no?

Repairability is more that once you buy it, you actually own it.

Apple does not support this model. Real repairability is when you can hack all components of hardware and software in your domain (which precludes hacking against cell towers, ISP telecom equipment, etc.).

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#355

Post by squarefoot »

Close, but no cigar. After 3 years or 2 major Android versions it still becomes an unsupported doorstop doomed to rot in a drawer until the owner throws it into a landfill. I totally understand not wanting to put resources into supporting old products, so the punchline should have been "...and after support is ceased, we unlock the bootloader". Now that would have made it interesting.

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#356

Post by louison11 »

People, don’t fight. There is a different consumer persona for each of the brands you’re comparing. People who like to be geeky and fix their own phones and install custom ROMs etc will keep on loving Android and phones like this one. People who have other priorities, just want the best phone on the market, just want it to work, and don’t mind paying more to fix it if it breaks, will go Apple. I don’t think anyone here will question that Apple always is 2 years ahead of Android phone makers. Don’t compare what’s not comparable.

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#357

Post by kuschku »

riku_iki wrote: post #295
solarkraft wrote: post #35

I'm happy about this! But, while repairability is always great, a major (maybe the biggest) part of phone obsolescence is due to software. 2 or 3 years of updates are a joke, Apple does up to 8. The best hope here is that this phone's repairability will attract a software hacking community to provide inofficial updates, but what a terrible thing to have to rely on. Besides: Phones by other brands like Pocophone are p…

> The real next innovation for an Android device maker will be providing at least 5 years of updates pixels starting with pixel 6 have 5 years of updates.

And require me to throw away headphones that have worked fine for decades.

Even this nokia phone has a 3.5mm port, why doesn't Google support it anymore?

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#358

Post by abliefern »

IceWreck wrote: post #349
solarkraft wrote: post #35

I'm happy about this! But, while repairability is always great, a major (maybe the biggest) part of phone obsolescence is due to software. 2 or 3 years of updates are a joke, Apple does up to 8. The best hope here is that this phone's repairability will attract a software hacking community to provide inofficial updates, but what a terrible thing to have to rely on. Besides: Phones by other brands like Pocophone are p…

Its a 150 EUR phone, what more do you expect >

I expect manufacturers not to offer bad options like a 150 € phone with 3 years of updates. Give me a 200€ phone with 5 years? Or a 10€ service fee per year of updates.

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#359

Post by testTED »

gman83 wrote: post #235
mlinksva wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The positive (and there's plenty of criticism; search and read) point being made about iphone is that it has a longer support duration. This seems highly complementary to repairability -- both seem important to maximize useful life -- and thus an entirely fair point, no? I'm recently on my 4th Android smartphone in 12 years (Galaxy S, Moto G, Pixel 2, Pixel 7) and would be still on the Pixel 2 if not for lack of upda…

FYI you can get LineageOS 20 (Android 13) for your Pixel 2 with the latest updates: https://www.xda-developers.com/lineageos-20-google-pixel-2-a...

Whose "latest updates"?

Re: Nokia launches DIY repairable budget Android phone

#360

Post by Nextgrid »

fsflover wrote: post #337
jokoon wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why is not the goal?

Having the same OS on my laptop and phone is amazing. Android turns a general-purpose device into a restricted one, without a possibility to run desktop apps. Desktop OS allows to use desktop apps on the phone and enjoy convergence: https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/community-wiki/-/wikis/Freque... .

> Android turns a general-purpose device into a restricted one

Android still runs the Linux kernel and the only reason you can't have shell access on it is user-hostile restrictions, which an open-source build wouldn't have.

I think it would be a lot easier to add desktop apps capability to Android for the minority that actually wants to run Linux apps on their phone than building a touch-optimized userspace from scratch.

If your desire is to run Linux desktop apps on Android I bet you can already do it if you find an X Server APK and got your Linux app to use it as your X display - that would've been a quick, pragmatic solution to satisfy the "Linux desktop" requirement while taking advantage of Android's mature & battle-tested touch-optimised userspace.

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