Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls • Hacker News Board

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#361

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:28 PM UTC

beezlebroxxxxxx wrote: post #307

ravenstine wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reflecting on that question means saying things that many people would find offensive. It's a lost cause to suggest that corporations implicitly understand something innate about female psychology and are taking advantage of it, and that's exactly why social media wins; the current politics you mentioned are a protective layer against taking meaningful action against the machine. If society was as concerned about the…

> ...that many people would find offensive. It's a lost cause to suggest that corporations implicitly understand something innate about female psychology... You are wrong. Feminism as a broad social movement, and as an academic discipline, explicitly sought to question and attack the social structures and behaviors that were often insisted to be "innate" about female psychology and well being. Basically no one would…

[deleted]

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#362

Post by bazmattaz » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:29 PM UTC

ThalesX wrote: post #99

My little sister just started high school and in less than a semester is unrecognizable. There is no more her in her day to day life, everything is curated to perfection. There are no more hobbies, no more interestes, no more curiosities, there is just "me". I was so confident in her ability to withstand the impact of social media, due to her education, but ultimately I was just shocked at how fast the change was. I…

> I now no longer believe the human brain is capable of withstanding its effects.

100% agree. I don’t think any brain born after the social media age can resist getting hooked on it. For those of us born before the dawn of the internet maybe some of us don’t get the appeal.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#363

Post by olliecornelia » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:29 PM UTC

beezlebroxxxxxx wrote: post #307

ravenstine wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reflecting on that question means saying things that many people would find offensive. It's a lost cause to suggest that corporations implicitly understand something innate about female psychology and are taking advantage of it, and that's exactly why social media wins; the current politics you mentioned are a protective layer against taking meaningful action against the machine. If society was as concerned about the…

> ...that many people would find offensive. It's a lost cause to suggest that corporations implicitly understand something innate about female psychology... You are wrong. Feminism as a broad social movement, and as an academic discipline, explicitly sought to question and attack the social structures and behaviors that were often insisted to be "innate" about female psychology and well being. Basically no one would…

That’s just your opinion.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#364

Post by tempestn » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:30 PM UTC

friendlyHornet wrote: post #333

mcbuilder wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And at 9th grade it's a free for all? Looking back the high school years would have been the worst for my own self esteem, angst, etc. Glad none of it was recorded. :)

Yup, I was the WORST when I was in 9th grade. I really don't envy my parents for having to deal with that version of me, and I did so much stuff I regret. My self-esteem back then was hair-thin; I use to obsess about EVERYTHING, from what I say, to how I talk, to how I smell, to how I walk, to the music I listen to, etc

Any advice for parents of a kid going through a similar period?

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#365

Post by andix » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:30 PM UTC

watwut wrote: post #347

andix wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know if that is even true. Maybe it’s the better call to give the kids a pack of cigarettes and send them to the kids who smoke secretly behind the gym, who just laugh about the instagram princesses. Or are those kids also a thing of the past?

You know, social aspect of smoking was fairly usual reason to start smoking. Because, people are social animals. And like it or not, there was period when smoking meant making networking connections non-smokers did not had access to. The proposed solution has nothing in it for girls. It does not make their lives better. It is not helping them in any way, except proposing new gender based restrictions on them. Yes, yo…

Girls can play video games too :)

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#366

Post by tristor » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:30 PM UTC

hax0ron3 wrote: post #356

tristor wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because I have a teenage stepdaughter, and I would like to make her life easier, not harder, and social media seems to be a net negative. It's unfortunately so integrated into the lives of teenagers they can't get away from it. I learned the hard way that social media was also bad for me, and I no longer use it (if you don't count HN and web-forums as social media). I also don't like restricting access to information…

Social media absolutely is information. For example, I can tell you from experience that it is very hard to really learn about another country if you are not living there unless you go read what the people of that country are saying on social media. What journalists write about the country is usually a very narrow view in comparison to all the information that becomes available to you if you read what people who live…

I'd argue it's hard to learn about another country without personally visiting it. To wit, I've made it a point to take my family to other countries, for us to learn other languages, and to get to experience different lifestyles around the world. There are a lot of things that my wife and I do to try to help my stepdaughter interact with information in healthy ways, but that's also easier said than done. To a large degree, the issues with social media have to do with the facade people put up and the underlying social interactions with her peer group, which are hard things to help a teenager address because parents are not directly involved in her peer group. You can only do so much, and at some point as a teenager, your child needs to find their own way. Putting up guard rails ("restricting information") is one way to help them navigate these nuances of life.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#367

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:32 PM UTC

timst4 wrote: post #123

warner25 wrote: post #2

I'm still reading it, but this is great so far. As a father to four little girls, though, it makes me feel really defeated. I can already see that social media has eroded my wife's mental health. I just don't know what to do in the next few years when our girls approach the age when everyone else will get an iPhone and have an Instagram account. I want to say no, but that leads to many other issues, including what th…

Middle School educator here. I can assure you that your daughters will not be alone when it comes to a moratorium on social media. However, the girls they may very well want to be friends with may be very much into social media and group chats. My advice is to be firm but also take steps to create social opportunities for your daughters. I have a 12yo and I host board game nights with amazing snack trays. I help her…

[deleted]

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#368

Post by marcellus23 » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:34 PM UTC

Zetice wrote: post #229

eastbound wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Boys have more capacity to transcend social media's focus on image and beauty by finding other ways to be valued as human beings. Before absconding boys from harm, maybe we should check twice on their health. They are often forgotten or their difficulties brushed off in studies. How are addictions progressing? Obesity maybe? Why are they all on 9Gag? Let’s check their level of racism and misogyny, it might be a pro…

Boys are for sure not exempt from harm, but the harm seems to be as a result of equity: https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/3868557-most-yo... > “Today in America, women expect more from men,” Levant said, “and unfortunately, so many men don’t have more to give.” Powerful stuff.

A bit disappointing seeing the implicit bias in that article. The thrust seems to basically be "women are fine, men are failing and need to do better". Some choice quotes:

> Women are tiring of their stereotypical role as full-time therapist for emotionally distant men

> “Today in America, women expect more from men,” Levant said, “and unfortunately, so many men don’t have more to give.”

> The same emotional deficits that hurt men in the dating pool also hamper them in forming meaningful friendships.

At first glance the article is even-handed, but reading closely you notice that not a single trait of women is described using negative terms, but men are described as needing women to be their therapists, as "not having more to give" women, and as having "emotional deficits."

This is basically an inversion of the ancient trope that women are defective men, and just as harmful.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#369

Post by ravenstine » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:34 PM UTC

beezlebroxxxxxx wrote: post #307

ravenstine wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reflecting on that question means saying things that many people would find offensive. It's a lost cause to suggest that corporations implicitly understand something innate about female psychology and are taking advantage of it, and that's exactly why social media wins; the current politics you mentioned are a protective layer against taking meaningful action against the machine. If society was as concerned about the…

> ...that many people would find offensive. It's a lost cause to suggest that corporations implicitly understand something innate about female psychology... You are wrong. Feminism as a broad social movement, and as an academic discipline, explicitly sought to question and attack the social structures and behaviors that were often insisted to be "innate" about female psychology and well being. Basically no one would…

You're proving my point whether you realize it or not.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#370

Post by cassac » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 10:34 PM UTC

waboremo wrote: post #230

cassac wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of it is never letting them start early in the first place. Stay strong and don’t give in. The old saying “If they were your real friends they wouldn’t care…” is more true than it is cliche. Try to make them understand that.

Or, instead of creating hyper rebellious kids who seek to go against your strong absolute rules - talk to them. Get them bored of social media. Explain what's really going on, what different forms of social media exist, how to talk to your friends directly in a safe way rather than go through the drudge of Instagram. What limits should exist when using any of these communication platforms. They'll understand. Often w…

Having absolute rules doesn’t mean having rebellious kids. I have an absolute rule to look both ways before crossing the street and nobody had ever rebelled against that.

But I 100% agree you do have to explain and you do have to eat your own dog food and try not to be too much of a hypocrite. They need to see you believe it yourself. And try not to lie with tall tales. I think every time a non life threatening absolute statement is proven false by experience they will lose trust.

I read or heard once that if you always told your child to put a coat on before they have actually experienced the cold they naturally don’t understand why they need it and will resist wearing one. But if you let them experience the cold and involve them in the thought process they will want to put a coat on. “Let’s see how it feels outside? Oooo it’s cold! What should we do?” Etc etc. I’ve tried to do that with most things (within reason and when applicable) and I think it gives them more confidence and understanding. Like the whole tell/show/include thing. The more experiences like this where you proved to be right the more they trust you even when the disagree.