Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls • Hacker News Board

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#211

Post by Spivak » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:18 PM UTC

ThalesX wrote: post #99

My little sister just started high school and in less than a semester is unrecognizable. There is no more her in her day to day life, everything is curated to perfection. There are no more hobbies, no more interestes, no more curiosities, there is just "me". I was so confident in her ability to withstand the impact of social media, due to her education, but ultimately I was just shocked at how fast the change was. I…

I wouldn't worry about it too much. Every girl goes through that, they're called your formative years for a reason. The start of HS is basically a reset where you go from chasing whatever fancy catches your attention shamelessly-ish to consciously developing an identity filtered through the social pressures of wanting to fit in. It starts to wane around 17 when we start feeling confident enough to be ourselves, but on purpose this time around. She'll be fine.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#212

Post by stuart78 » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:18 PM UTC

austinl wrote: post #68

warner25 wrote: post #2

I'm still reading it, but this is great so far. As a father to four little girls, though, it makes me feel really defeated. I can already see that social media has eroded my wife's mental health. I just don't know what to do in the next few years when our girls approach the age when everyone else will get an iPhone and have an Instagram account. I want to say no, but that leads to many other issues, including what th…

I once sat next to a dean of private school on a plane—she mentioned that the ~100 parents that sent their children to the school signed an agreement that they would restrict their children's access to social media until 9th grade. I have no idea how well it was adhered to or enforced, but it surprised me that the parents of the school and the dean were trying to collectively organize action around this issue to prev…

At my kid's school the target is no phones until 8th grade. It seems many people adhere to the guidance, but that is only based on what we see casually, and we'll see how it looks over the next few years. Some 3rd/4th graders have smart watches which allow comms but not meaningful apps. Not sure it is a great compromise for my family, but interesting to see what results other folks find as we all navigate it.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#213

Post by officeplant » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:19 PM UTC

mcbuilder wrote: post #120

austinl wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I once sat next to a dean of private school on a plane—she mentioned that the ~100 parents that sent their children to the school signed an agreement that they would restrict their children's access to social media until 9th grade. I have no idea how well it was adhered to or enforced, but it surprised me that the parents of the school and the dean were trying to collectively organize action around this issue to prev…

And at 9th grade it's a free for all? Looking back the high school years would have been the worst for my own self esteem, angst, etc. Glad none of it was recorded. :)

I've found my blog posts as an angsty teen from 2000->2002 thanks to LiveJournal still existing. They were definitely not worth being recorded, but it was a great wakeup call to the general idea that I was fairly mature back then.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#214

Post by IncRnd » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:20 PM UTC

theGnuMe wrote: post #89

IncRnd wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's letting kids parent themselves.

What does it mean to parent anyway?

Even chatgpt knows.

(prompt:) what does it mean to parent?

  To parent means to raise and nurture a child from infancy to adulthood,
  providing them with love, care, guidance, and support as they grow and
  develop. Parenting involves a wide range of responsibilities and
  activities, including providing for a child's physical needs, such as
  food, shelter, and medical care, as well as their emotional and
  psychological needs, such as love, affection, and encouragement.

  Effective parenting also involves setting boundaries and rules, providing
  discipline when necessary, and teaching children important life skills,
  such as communication, problem-solving, and decision-making. As children
  grow and mature, parents often adjust their parenting style to meet their
  children's changing needs and help them develop into independent and
  responsible adults.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#215

Post by hbrn » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:20 PM UTC

mrpopo wrote: post #87

I don't necessarily disagree with the conclusion, but the dismissal of other factors is insufficient: > Why did a measure of loneliness at school go up around the world only after 2012, as the global economy got better and better? The economy didn't get better for everyone, in fact inequality rose starkly; this might be a correlating factor. > It’s not because of the 9/11 attacks, wars in the middle east, or school s…

> The economy didn't get better for everyone, in fact inequality rose starkly

What is your source for this "fact"? There were no drastic changes in Gini coefficient in the USA.

Also, I'm pretty sure suicide rate was also increasing in wealthy households.

> How about climate anxiety/eco-anxiety?

Do you really believe teenage girls have "climate anxiety"? Is there anything that indicates people suddenly became more aware of climate change in 2012? (the only spike Google Trends has is around 2007).

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#216

Post by kevin_thibedeau » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:20 PM UTC

flerchin wrote: post #19

barbazoo wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It must be frustrating to see this problem approaching and not knowing what to do. I wonder if at some point the only way out is to radically change one's family's lifestyle. Maybe homeschooling, very limited technology at home, living in a community with like-minded people, something like that?

Let's find a solution that does not involve expanding the Amish model.

Mennonite with a cell phone:

https://youtu.be/Pt_XU4W4DBA?t=858

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#217

Post by colonCapitalDee » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:20 PM UTC

8f2ab37a-ed6c wrote: post #9

I wonder if online dating tends to lead to similar impacts to mental health for some groups of people as social media does to teen girls. Just like in Haidt's examples, it's impersonal, phone-based, leading to constant social comparison, feelings of rejection, ostracism and ghosting. I wouldn't be shocked if a few years from now research came out showing that it has similar effects to adults, but they're just better…

I tried Tinder (and Hinge) as an average looking guy and found it to be dehumanizing. I rarely got matches, the matches I got usually didn't respond to my messages, and even when they did I could tell they weren't invested in the interaction. I've got a great job, a decent face, I work out, I've got friends, family, hobbies, and passions. I genuinely like myself; I'm satisfied with my life and my personal development. But I'm not in the top n% of attractiveness, so nobody cared.

I know the solution is to focus on in-person dating and building genuine connections with people in the real world, but I've had no success with that either. I asked my friends if they knew anyone they could set me up with, but nobody did. My job and my hobbies are male dominated. Every activity in my area (a large US tech hub) that I've tried is male dominated except for yoga. Maybe things will change as I get older (I'm in my early twenties), but if things continue as they are now it will take a minor miracle for me to find a relationship before I die. I just feel so lost, I don't know what to do.

Maybe this is oversharing, but I just wanted to get it out there. Thanks for reading.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#218

Post by shagie » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:21 PM UTC

nerdponx wrote: post #101

shagie wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the generations are a bit dated - https://waitbutwhy.com/2013/09/why-generation-y-yuppies-are-... > Social media creates a world for Lucy where A) what everyone else is doing is very out in the open, B) most people present an inflated version of their own existence, and C) the people who chime in the most about their careers are usually those whose careers (or relationships) are going the best, while struggling…

This article is the classic "millennials are sad because they have unrealistically high expectations" drivel that I thought we had buried for good. Even for 2013 it seems pretty trashy. Lucy doesn't think she's unusually wonderful, and to assume so is completely unfair to Lucy. Lucy was told over and over and over that all she needed to do was go to college and work hard at anything somewhat respectable, and financia…

The high expectation drivel fed by parents is something that in that context is something that the millennials needed to overcome. That, however, is only part of the story.

Setting aside the expectations of "you are special and can be anything you want to be" from parents there is also the "the world around you is crafted to a degree that previous generations didn't deal with."

Recognizing that part of it is also important. If you compare yourself to influencers and expect to be able to live a life like them, you will likely be unhappy. Correspondingly, if you compare yourself to the crafted image of your peers all the time, you may feel that you're not doing as well as they are.

That part isn't a millennial issue but rather a "everyone who uses social media to compare or boast about their current social situations."

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#219

Post by AndrewKemendo » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:21 PM UTC

warner25 wrote: post #2

I'm still reading it, but this is great so far. As a father to four little girls, though, it makes me feel really defeated. I can already see that social media has eroded my wife's mental health. I just don't know what to do in the next few years when our girls approach the age when everyone else will get an iPhone and have an Instagram account. I want to say no, but that leads to many other issues, including what th…

I had my 12 year old daughter read the article and after she argued a while I said: Ok, write up your rejoinder and I will post it and see what others think.

For context we severely restrict access to social media in our house, but of course they find ways around this as expected (I don't pi-hole because I want them to learn to be hackers)

-----------------------------------

*Why I think it’s reasonable for me to have social media :)*

After reading the article, I still believe that I should be allowed to have social media for several reasons.

First of all, the article stated that people using social media moderately (half an hour to one and a half hours a day) had little to no decline in their mental health, compared to a large mental health decline in those using it a lot (3-5+ hours a day), and with the limit on my phone, I would be using it minimally, especially because I use a lot of my phone time daily to listen to music (like 5 [REDACTED], which I am listening to right now) and to text my friends, so I would only use it for 20 or so minutes a day, which is very low.

Another thing that the article mentioned is that people these days who do not have social media may feel excluded or left out, and may even miss things because they don’t have social media, which can lead to a decline in their mental health as well. It was also mentioned that not every social media user’s mental health is impacted, especially those who use it in moderation. Yet another point was that people will compare themselves to other people on there.

In case you hadn’t already noticed, I don’t really do that. I do find people pretty, but I don’t usually compare myself to them. Plus, most of them are significantly older than me, so I don’t expect myself to look like them anyway.

I believe that using social media could actually have greater benefits for me, such as being able to record Tiktok dances with my friends, or messaging people on Snapchat. I could also follow my friends and then help support whatever they do (for example, one of my friends has an account for [REDACTED]). Also, studies have shown that when people don’t get to do something as a child/teenager isn’t allowed to do or have something in moderation, they are more likely to do or have it in excess as an adult.

Re: Social media is a cause, not a correlate, of mental illness in teen girls

#220

Post by gtvwill » Wed, Feb 22, 2023, 9:22 PM UTC

nerdponx wrote: post #101

shagie wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the generations are a bit dated - https://waitbutwhy.com/2013/09/why-generation-y-yuppies-are-... > Social media creates a world for Lucy where A) what everyone else is doing is very out in the open, B) most people present an inflated version of their own existence, and C) the people who chime in the most about their careers are usually those whose careers (or relationships) are going the best, while struggling…

This article is the classic "millennials are sad because they have unrealistically high expectations" drivel that I thought we had buried for good. Even for 2013 it seems pretty trashy. Lucy doesn't think she's unusually wonderful, and to assume so is completely unfair to Lucy. Lucy was told over and over and over that all she needed to do was go to college and work hard at anything somewhat respectable, and financia…

You don't have any kids yet do you? If you do, what dreams do you fill their heads with if not that of a happy life?