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My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

danlawton.substack.com

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Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#61

Post by ImHereToVote »

coldtea wrote: post #32
wodenokoto wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's definitely something a Thai business man would do though.

Even the Thai businessman (and the whole country) has been quite removed from the culture that made Buddhism have a meaning there (as opposed to an empty shell). Though, even so, he'd still be far closer to it than someone in San Francisco who adopted it as a consumer lifestyle good...

Yeah, only the Nepalese are pure enough to be Buddhists.

I for one applaud the Taliban for blowing up statues of the Buddha. They aren't posers like we are.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#62

Post by fluoridation »

coldtea wrote: post #54
rg111 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Buddhist buddhism involves demons, hell, and more praying or even chanting than meditating for the general population. You are mentioning Mahayana or later Vajrayana Buddhism. Buddha never asks you to pray, and he did not teach any concepts of hells or demons. Please stop appropriating Buddhism. You have no authority. Just like Christianity practised in the US is not true Christianity, Buddhism practised in East As…

> Just like Christianity practised in the US is not true Christianity, Buddhism practised in East Asia is no truer Buddhism. That's the "really existing Buddhism" - the kind that matters, and the only kind with roots in a millenia old tradition. The rest is either spirituallity tourists using it as a lifestyle accessory (the same way they'd adopt pilates or switch to some new age shit), or spirituallity "nerds" getti…

>That's the "really existing Buddhism" - the kind that matters, and the only kind with roots in a millenia old tradition.

First, even if this "pseudo-Buddhism" is a lame imitation by Westerners, the fact that it's an imitation means that it shares the same roots with "proper Buddhism". Second, why is proper Buddhism "the only one that matters"? I would say none of it matters, you would say only one of them matters, and there's probably some people who say both of them matter. By what criterion does one opinion take precedence?

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#63

Post by zozbot234 »

scop wrote: post #22

Had anybody else noticed that for many Stoicism has replaced Buddhism as the “cool” and “intellectual” spirituality amongst those in the liberal tech world?

Stoicism is more like Buddhism on easy mode for those in the Western tradition. Even Buddhists themselves are very clear that one should not pursue serious meditation unless they have their sīla (morality, ethical behavior) down pat and are at an appropriate stage of life where they have the time and means for it; Stoicism is all about the practice of sīla. If you skip on that, you end up with stories like OP's, and the people suffering psychotic breaks while on a meditative retreat.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#65

Post by Karunamon »

lr4444lr wrote: post #60
me551ah wrote: post #27

What he experienced is actually expected, deeper states of meditation bring out even harder experiences. Meditation is marketed in the west as some sort of a relaxation pill, designed to cure anxiety and other mental ailments. It's actually not. Meditation is a hardcore exercise for the mind and if your mind is not strong enough then deeper states will break you.

Sounds as conveniently unfalsifibale as any more patent pseudoscience.

Anything as subjective as one's own mindset interpreted by oneself is incompatible with the scientific method in the first place. It's not the right tool for the job because it is impossible to objectively measure the results.

That does not make those results any less real.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#66

Post by jshaqaw »

coldtea wrote: post #39
gtirloni wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No True Scotsman? Or are you saying that in most cases it's just superficial? I certainly have met Buddhism pratictioners in the West that were deep into the way of life and culture.

> I certainly have met Buddhism pratictioners in the West that were deep into the way of life and culture. They are "big in the way of life and culture" the same way they'd be deep in punk rock or effective altruism. Not as people living in a culture and tradition that is Buddhist - in an environment that nurtered and fosters its practice, and with all that comes from actual living tradition of a religion. It's more…

Rather sweeping statements about an awful lot of people you have never met.

It is actually easier to be superficial with spiritual practice when immersed in its culture. Plenty of “spiritual” practitioners are playing social status games, going through motions in a societally rewarded and expected manner, etc…

Perhaps friend you are projecting your own dissatisfactions with finding an all encompassing one true meaning onto others?

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#67

Post by samastur »

HeckFeck wrote: post #59
me551ah wrote: post #27

What he experienced is actually expected, deeper states of meditation bring out even harder experiences. Meditation is marketed in the west as some sort of a relaxation pill, designed to cure anxiety and other mental ailments. It's actually not. Meditation is a hardcore exercise for the mind and if your mind is not strong enough then deeper states will break you.

Curious. It sounds like meditation has been misappropriated in the same way as therapy. Therapy _should_ bring up difficult emotions and experiences from the past because they are often the root of dysfunction and frustration in the present.

And then what?

I'm genuinely curious as a loved one rejects therapy exactly because she already knows what causes of her depression are and does not see any use in debating them further as they only bring her down.

I don't have experience or knowledge to explain how it would help her.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#68

Post by fluoridation »

dinkleberg wrote: post #36
groffee wrote: post #5

See how many times they write the word 'I'? They've never meditated properly even once. Teacher my ass, these people do way more damage than help anyone.

How is one to write a story of their personal story in which they are the main, and for the most part the only character, without using the word “I” all the time?

"Rather than retelling it as a subjective narrative, you could retell it as an objective or omniscient narrator. It would sound completely ridiculous if the listener realizes that you're just telling your account from your perspective, particularly if you need to refer to yourself in the third person", said fluoridation as he thought how absurd the idea even is.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#69

Post by JoachimS »

AstixAndBelix wrote: post #34
ghoastl wrote: post #9

My most intense mindfulness experience was on a two-week silent retreat, in the woods, isolated from all of humanity. At the beginning, I met only the creatures of the forest and heard only the whispers of the trees. By the sixth day I was hallucinating gold and purple snakes slithering out of my belly onto the ground around me. By the eighth day I had visions of a cloud island vista with animals the world had never…

[flagged]

Calling him a liar is quite uncalled for.

Re: My mindfulness practice led me to meltdown (2021)

#70

Post by andai »

> Once we have crossed the Arising and Passing Away (and if we don’t suddenly die or get severe brain damage due to some unfortunate life circumstances), we shall enter insight stages five through ten regardless of whether we want to. It doesn’t matter if we practice from this point on; once we cross the A&P, we are in the Dark Night to some degree and become what is sometimes called a “Dark Night yogi”, or simply “darknighter”, until we figure out how to get through it. If we do get through it without getting to the first stage of enlightenment, we will have to go through it again and again until we do. I mean this in the most absolute terms. It appears to be a hardwired part of human physiology as far as I can tell. I have a very large and growing body of case studies and a wealth of shared experiences among meditation friends and acquaintances to back this up, and I am not alone. Tens of thousands of meditators have noticed these stages in their own practice and countless teachers have noticed them also.

Daniel Ingram, Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha

https://www.mctb.org/mctb2/table-of-contents/part-iv-insight...

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