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Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

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Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#81
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The left is downplaying it because it happened on their guy's watch, and he's not doing much about it. In fact, the Biden administration just said that Ohio wouldn't get any disaster money for this. So either the derailment's consequences are nothing, or the left's guy is ineffective at dealing with the real world. The left therefore chooses to say (and even think?) that the problems are nothing.

This is exactly it and it’s so sad to watch. Had it happened under trump the sides would have been switched.

I feel like the narrative would be switched, but the events would have played out the same.

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#82
post #70

Air and surface water measurements are mentioned for the train car contents. Is anyone aware if there is top soil or swipe testing for the train car contents or suspected partial combustion compounds? That black cloud did not look like the cleanest burn. Isn’t it naive to burn a mixture then test for the fuel in the aftermath and say look no fuel here there must be no contamination? What a mess.

Purely speculating: it's possible, in the scenario that you described, that the fuel is far more toxic than the combustion compounds, so something was indeed achieved Of course, my understanding is that the combustion compounds are also toxic, but I wanted to respond to what you've written.

I think it was an impossible call to make and the product of a bunch of terrible circumstances and prior decisions. Additionally the response team was probably motivated to act instead of wait for the situation to develop unpredictably and they were reading a climbing temperature. If they believed it was avoiding an uncontrolled explosion where the was no idea how the rail car contents would release then it could be the right call in hindsight. I can see not wanting a big plume of that uncombusted stuff releasing, persisting and causing acute and chronic harm. I cannot argue anything about the call to burn it or not that sounds like a terrible choice.

My point is the rush to resume normalcy and choose the risk of false negative reassurance when its clear this is not a well thought out procedure is terrible. Testing for raw components alone neglects the entire set of potential contamination and routes. Also is a one mile radius evacuation adequate for an open burn like that? I don't know what is but it'd be nice to have support to leave for a time if living on the outside margin of "might not die depending on wind direction".

The story coverage in newspapers is decently good I don't think anything is being swept under the rug. But the official response and effort to put the threat in the past seems like damage control to exit the news cycle vs having any concern whatsoever about the people that live there. It is a poor populated area of the country and it is acceptable to open burn a million pounds of chlorinated petrochemicals. I know this happens in different ways under environmental permitting all over the US like in the gulf, etc. so its not unique. Still its terrible.

And the state and local officials are handling the media coverage and disaster response while the US federal government is shooting down multiple balloons out of the air with $400k missiles in the great 2023 balloon wars. It is absurd.

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#83

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The American liberal media is not "left" they are liberal. That being said, they are probably trying to downplay it because it's directly related to the railroad union strike that Biden shut down a few months back. They wanted more time off-- which would mean more workers and less hours.

Believe they were also striking for safer working conditions.

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#84

I've posted on Hackernews before mentioning that I grew up in East Palestine and my entire immediate and most of my extended family either live in the town itself or within 20 miles. It's been surreal to see this event unplay in the media. Some things I haven't seen talked about: 1. How desperately poor most of the population in that area is. My fear is that if the crash has long terms effects people will never get j…

Since you have family in the area maybe you can answer this question: What do people need and is there anything that can be done to help them?

This will be an unsatisfying answer.

Thanks to my job as a software engineer I felt like I was in the position to help people financially but the dozens of people I've asked at this point have all told me the same thing:

1. Their immediate needs are taken care of.

The ones who got evacuated were put up in hotels at first and have tons of support from local organizations. The ones who were more than 1 mile away generally are staying with friends until they feel like it's okay to return home.

2. They want life to return to normal.

This has been a major disruption in their daily routines. They want it resolved so they can get back to living their lives.

3. They're anxious and terrified about the health implications.

Ignoring the actual smoke cloud when they did the burn: the smell of the burn went for miles. It's hard to believe someone telling everything is safe when you home still reeks of chemical smell.

When the burn happens lots of people experienced runny noses, sore throats, and other minor symptoms. Was it a result of the chemicals? Was it stress? Was it all in their head? We just don't know.

There's a ton of dubious information flowing around social media scaring them. They don't know what to believe.

---

The main thing that will help people is to feel like their situation is being taken seriously.

Things like a congressional hearing to establish answers to what happened and how it can be rectified. The federal government stepping in and committing to long term testing of the area. The railroad being forced to provide medical screening for at least the next several years.

Someone in a position of authority stepping up and saying they're committed to making things right instead of trying to minimize the situation or use it as a talking point.

Those are things no individual can do by themselves but if I had a suggestion I guess it would just be to reach out to your congressperson and tell them that you care about this getting fixed and never happening again.

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#85

I would absolutely not trust 'government experts' or anyone hired by Norfolk Southern to do a thorough job of sampling and testing the surrounding environment. The EPA's gross failures in the Deepwater Horizon blowout with respect to overseeing the use of surfactants like Corexit should be proof enough of that. Unfortunately a rigorous sampling and testing protocol by an independent registered laboratory (which is wh…

> The technology needed is well-established, just collect a lot of vials of water, soil, stream bed cores etc. on a grid scale focusing on the entire region, paying attention to downwind zones from the accident in particular. Then they need to be run through an established, documented extract-and-analysis procedure.

Yes, and in addition, surface- and groundwater transport should be simulated given any known hydrogeologic data on the region. The federal government in fact develops free and open source software for exactly this. NS should have limited involvement in the testing process, feds and independent parties should collect data independently and compare results in public view.

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or that Biden used federal authority to quash the railroad union protests for better wages as safer conditions.

I mean, Biden brokered a deal to avert the strike, worked with the house and senate to craft a law guaranteeing the railworkers the benefits they were seeking which was then filibustered by senate republicans, but that's apparently too complicated or politically inconvenient for HN to understand so they pretend like stopping the strike was the end of that story. https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/3758436-senate-reje…

You could easily rephrase your comment as "Biden took away their only option for self-directed action and then passed the buck to an organization known for doing nothing."

Sometimes complexity doesn't actually add anything useful :) Focusing on the DC play-by-play is good for convincing yourself the other team is at fault, and not much else.

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#87
post #14

I wonder how many of the symptoms people are reporting are just placebo

Or pre-existing conditions due to chronic lack of health care, if the region is as poor as is described in this thread.

That are worsened by the amount of stress this event likely caused

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#88

[flagged]

[flagged]

Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments to Hacker News? You've been doing it repeatedly, unfortunately. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.

The idea here is: if you have a substantive point, make it thoughtfully; if not, please don't comment until you do.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Clinic to open near Ohio derailment as health worries linger

#90
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, Biden brokered a deal to avert the strike, worked with the house and senate to craft a law guaranteeing the railworkers the benefits they were seeking which was then filibustered by senate republicans, but that's apparently too complicated or politically inconvenient for HN to understand so they pretend like stopping the strike was the end of that story. https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/3758436-senate-reje…

You could easily rephrase your comment as "Biden took away their only option for self-directed action and then passed the buck to an organization known for doing nothing." Sometimes complexity doesn't actually add anything useful :) Focusing on the DC play-by-play is good for convincing yourself the other team is at fault, and not much else.

Sure, you could rephrase it to something inaccurate if it was your prerogative to "both sides" something that failed almost entirely along party lines after attracting the support of several very conservative senators. I'm not sure what value that adds though :)
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