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China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

economist.com

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Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#71

Post by yorwba »

wolverine876 wrote: post #8

These forces are used to spy on, harass, and oppress Chinese dissidents and human rights advocates. You can find many other news sources focused on that: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=chinese+police+new+york&iar=news&i... Including the NY Times: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=chinese+police+new+york+site%3Anyt... Why did the Economist omit that entirely (unless I overlooked something)? Also, why repeat Chinese government clai…

I think you're overestimating the importance of politics and underestimating the prevalence of people wanting to make a quick buck.

An active warzone like Myanmar is not a good choice when you're a dissident looking for safety, but quite convenient when you're running a highly profitable criminal enterprise and can get an armed gang to give you protection for a cut.

Now, many of the 54,000 that quanfan is claimed to have returned from Myanmar likely weren't there entirely voluntarily (recruiters promise people high wages and generously charter a bus to get them to their new workplace; failing to mention that it's going to be a cross-border trip, they won't be allowed to leave until they've "paid back their debts", and room and board aren't free) and others are only providing ancillary services to the gangs (shops, restaurants, bars...) and didn't commit any crimes beyond crossing the border illegally, but from what I've read about people who were enslaved in Myanmar and managed to escape (e.g. https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/rA9JHSPQJWjnjgaqC-B76g ) the drain caused by quanfan led to personnel shortages for the gangs, making it easier to get away.

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#72

Post by twixfel »

throwawaaay129 wrote: post #60
twixfel wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's certainly much safer to be pro-China in the West than pro-West or pro-USA in China, if that makes you feel any better. So don't complain too much about how difficult life is for you as a supporter of the CCP.

I'm not complaining or comparing myself to anyone. I didn't say I support the CCP either. Just explaining why people might use throwaway accounts If I was currently living in China I wouldn't be posting anything remotely political. Obviously they have it harder there

OK if by "positive about China" you mean statements like "I like Chinese food" or "Chinese history is very interesting" then obviously this not an issue. I assumed support for the CCP and the broader Chinese political system was implicit in your concern about expressing something "positive about China". Otherwise I've no idea what the point you're making is.

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#73

Post by mr90210 »

cm2012 wrote: post #23

China is really terrifying. I watched a video today of them taking pets from people and beating those pets to death as an anti covid measure this year. A billion plus people, largely uneducated, run by a despotic dictator- scary shit.

> A billion plus people, largely uneducated, run by a despotic dictator- scary shit.

It’s for things like this that I laugh in private when some people say that China is the future.

For sure the future of a shittier world.

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#74

Post by hef19898 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #70
hef19898 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One could make the case, that the people working there should be a) arrested or b) expelled from the country. Same goes for every other nation in which China maintains those stations, they are all over Europe it seems. But hey, at least China is doing it themselves instead ofisusing Interpol red notices like other authoritarian regimes do.

> people working there should be a) arrested or b) expelled from the country If they’ve threatened or kidnapped someone on behalf of the CCP, they should be tried as what they are: covert agents, possibly of an adversary.

Absolutely. That's not gonna happen so, is it? And from a very cynical poijt of view I get it, this is basically an intelligence (as in spy craft during the cold war) war. And our Western intel services propably have a high interest in learbing as much as they can about the methods, tools and operations of their Chinese counterparts. And as long as China only kidnaps and harasses their own people, who cares? Heck, even if it would be "own" people, it would still be a trade-off.

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#75

Post by BlueTemplar »

potatofarmer45 wrote: post #9

What people don't realize is that extra-judicial "persuasion" is also commonly applied for strategic business interests. I recall a discussion with a someone at an electronics company a while ago where they described recent breaches and leaks of IP to Chinese state companies by unwitting employees pressured by these extra-judicial police.

No question that this is a threat, but at this point I also feel compelled to point out that the US(&UK) judiciary has been accused of the same :

1.) https://www.economist.com/business/2019/01/17/how-the-americ...

(Notably, some of the most vocal opponents of Macron go as far as to accuse him of treason for personal gain in this case, though their case is IMHO kind of thin.)

2.) https://www.bbc.com/news/business-51277946

Tom Enders, his compliance officer John Harrison, DARPA's & silicon valley's Paul Eremenko and others have been accused of (ab)using this probe with the result that Airbus' strategic information (including business one) became openly accessible to the USA, and through them, to their competitor : Boeing.

3.) Not to be forgotten : https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-32542140

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#76

Post by tw1984 »

cm2012 wrote: post #23

China is really terrifying. I watched a video today of them taking pets from people and beating those pets to death as an anti covid measure this year. A billion plus people, largely uneducated, run by a despotic dictator- scary shit.

> A billion plus people, largely uneducated

You do realize that this is the exact excuse used by the CCP for not allowing general elections?

Openly support CCP's policies won't get you too far on HackerNew.

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#77

Post by midasuni »

anigbrowl wrote: post #24
thablackbull wrote: post #3

[flagged]

Normalizing and redirection is a lame response. Extrajudicial kidnappings by states are bad no matter who is doing them, but I think you can probably find a better reference than a nearly 20 year old example that became a major scandal within the US, and when you do you can make it the subject of its own submission rather than a distraction from this one.

Seleznev comes to mind

https://www.businessinsider.com/notorious-russian-hacker-kid...

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#78

Post by psiops »

philliphaydon wrote: post #46
cm2012 wrote: post #23

China is really terrifying. I watched a video today of them taking pets from people and beating those pets to death as an anti covid measure this year. A billion plus people, largely uneducated, run by a despotic dictator- scary shit.

[WARNING: It can be graphic] https://twitter.com/search?q=china%20covid%20dog&src=typed_q... Some of it's pretty sickening, but during covid Twitter has made little to no effort to remove alot of the animal abuse videos from its platform.

I am not clicking that.

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#79

Post by petesergeant »

wolverine876 wrote: post #8

These forces are used to spy on, harass, and oppress Chinese dissidents and human rights advocates. You can find many other news sources focused on that: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=chinese+police+new+york&iar=news&i... Including the NY Times: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=chinese+police+new+york+site%3Anyt... Why did the Economist omit that entirely (unless I overlooked something)? Also, why repeat Chinese government clai…

It doesn't omit it entirely:

> Operation Fox Hunt is a worldwide effort to repatriate people it describes as corrupt officials (the FBI says many are also wanted for political reasons)

I'd be curious to know the numbers of people being extrajudicially extradited in this way for political reasons vs actual crime, but I can't imagine those numbers are readily available.

Re: China’s police are ensnaring thousands of suspects abroad

#80

Post by vixen99 »

hypertele-Xii wrote: post #59
philliphaydon wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[WARNING: It can be graphic] https://twitter.com/search?q=china%20covid%20dog&src=typed_q... Some of it's pretty sickening, but during covid Twitter has made little to no effort to remove alot of the animal abuse videos from its platform.

I thought I'd merely be disgusted, I'm actually crying now. Animal mass murder. And having fun while doing it.

I dare not look since I'd probably follow suit. What can be done, if anything, about this evidently deep-seated capacity in some of us, to 'have fun' while knowingly inflicting pain and suffering on other living creatures who share our planet?
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