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Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

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Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#61

Post by aednichols »

takoid wrote: post #16
Kyragem wrote: post #12

[flagged]

Here is the USDOT press release from 2017 on this: https://www.phmsa.dot.gov/news/usdot-announces-intent-repeal... Can anyone speak to whether these electronically controlled pneumatic brakes would have prevented or lessened the severity of this derailment in Ohio?

We do know that the crew was notified of the hot axle by an automatic defect detector. I don't think we know yet what their reaction was.

If they didn't brake... then the brake technology had no effect. If they did brake, more sophisticated brake control systems could definitely stop it faster, and would reduce internal stresses that can could contribute to derailment.

My personal speculation is that the crew tried to gamble and get the train to a more convenient stopping location, either of their own volition or as directed by dispatch.

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#62

Post by 0x008 »

time_to_smile wrote: post #51
0x008 wrote: post #8

This is basically the plot of “white noise” with Adam driver (on netflix).

Which is based on the famous Don Delillo novel. This reads a bit like describing LotR as "that movie with Viggo Mortensen".

Yes that is right. Forgive me, but don delillo is not so famous outside of the English speaking world so I did not think of mentioning it, although I have seen his name in the end credits.

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#63

Post by themitigating »

passwordoops wrote: post #39
Kyragem wrote: post #12

[flagged]

So Biden, through the Department of Transport and Pete Buttigieg couldn't put those regulations back in place? Or were right in forcing striking rail workers back to work instead of, oh I don't know, supported them on basic issues like safety? Yes Republicans are bad. But so are Dems, and their voters refusing to hold the party accountable for obvious failures. It's why the country is going to shift. R's pass bad pol…

How do you know the crash was the result of missing regulations?

Republicans are against government regulations,you know "big government" and all that, so why would they do a better job?

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#64

Post by xwdv »

unethical_ban wrote: post #47
Workaccount2 wrote: post #15

Before everyone loses there mind, because this story has oddly been on blast 2 weeks after the incident: VC is a gas a room temperature. None of the VC cars were ruptured in the crash. They were vented and ignited by workers to avoid explosion. Burning VC produces carbon oxides, HCl, phosgene, and formaldehyde. HCl, Phosgene become hydrochloric acid in the atmosphere. The total amount of hydrochloric acid this could…

It should not be seen as business as usual when these kinds of things happen. It was at least tolerable due to my ignorance when you talked about these chemicals boiling off, but then to say "no biggie that petroleum spilled everywhere, I'm sure it burned off too." The whistle has been blown on the rails and the rail companies for some time, and now a catastrophe has occurred. We should be severely punishing the rail…

Nationalizing is an overreach. This is why events like this have to be downplayed because if you don’t the vultures will swoop in with their own agendas and try to stir up emotions to garner support for unpopular causes.

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#65

Post by kevviiinn »

themitigating wrote: post #55
colpabar wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason people are so upset isn't necessarily because of the environmental impact, it's because the people who work on these trains have been warning things like this could happen for years, and when they tried to strike over it, the federal government stepped in and crushed them into submission. There was a car on that train that was on fire for at least 20 miles before the derailment. If I can get pulled over fo…

"People are upset because it's another case of the government completely failing to do their jobs of keeping regular people safe, " Even though this is a private company you only blamed the government?

Part of the government's responsibility is to regulate

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#66

Post by cshimmin »

themitigating wrote: post #55
colpabar wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason people are so upset isn't necessarily because of the environmental impact, it's because the people who work on these trains have been warning things like this could happen for years, and when they tried to strike over it, the federal government stepped in and crushed them into submission. There was a car on that train that was on fire for at least 20 miles before the derailment. If I can get pulled over fo…

"People are upset because it's another case of the government completely failing to do their jobs of keeping regular people safe, " Even though this is a private company you only blamed the government?

I think this comment is referring to the govt blocking the rail workers from taking collective action against the private companies.

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#67

Post by jsonne »

I've been seeing content on Tiktok where even 100 miles away they're seeing small dead fish which is apparently according to the folks making the videos a massive red flag.

In general I grow super weary of companies and the government downplaying these sorts of things. It seems to constantly follow the pattern of people saying "It's not that bad" and then only years later do we actually see the horrific health and environmental effects of these sorts of things play out when it's too late for the folks that have been impacted. I feel so helpless like I wish there was a way to prevent this or create enough real accountability that people actually work to minimize these sorts of things but it never seems to pan out that way. My hunch is that the behind the scenes culprit of "why" this happens is rather banal, insurance covers it so people don't have to change, and it seems like those policies create a ton of moral hazard but I don't know the alternatives. I have no answers here it just feels like yet another weight on the side of the scale that the average person has very little control over their lives even for simple things like not being hurt by toxic chemicals in soil / drinking water. Feels easy to lose even more faith in the institutions that are supposed to protect us all.

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#68

Post by throwaway894345 »

grecy wrote: post #48
perihelions wrote: post #7

- "On Sunday, the EPA released a list, written by Norfolk Southern, of the toxic chemicals that were in the derailed cars. In addition to vinyl chloride and butyl acrylate, it mentions ethylhexyl acrylate, which can cause headaches, nausea, and respiratory problems in people exposed to it; as well as isobutylene, which can make people dizzy and drowsy." This is anodyne phrasing that omits the lede, which is that this…

> which can cause headaches, nausea, and respiratory problems.... can make people dizzy and drowsy I also love this phrasing that talks about the immediate uncomfortable reactions, but makes no mention on the extremely serious long-term implications of exposure. These chemicals won't just make you feel unpleasant in the moment, they'll kill you in the long run.

I mean, I guess "lung cancer" is technically a "respiratory problem" but damn...

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#69

Post by aednichols »

falcolas wrote: post #45
takoid wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is the USDOT press release from 2017 on this: https://www.phmsa.dot.gov/news/usdot-announces-intent-repeal... Can anyone speak to whether these electronically controlled pneumatic brakes would have prevented or lessened the severity of this derailment in Ohio?

The cause was an overheated wheel bearing melting and dislodging the axle, causing a derailment. The overheating was detected, and ignored. The quote is, as I recall, "The next sensor will detect it if it's a problem." Could the electric brakes have helped? Not sure in this specific case. In other cases? Probably. Air brakes are remarkably cool technology (how the valves work still boggles me from time to time) but t…

I am amused by how much remixing of facts is happening. On Reddit, I learned that the railroad was negligent for not replacing the rails since the Civil War.

Re: Health concerns grow in East Palestine, Ohio, after train derailment

#70

Post by themitigating »

r85804306610 wrote: post #57
Kyragem wrote: post #12

[flagged]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_United_States_railroad_la... > "The rise of precision scheduled railroading has resulted in resource and staffing cuts; to compensate railroad companies have enacted strict attendance policies for employees. These policies eliminate any free time which workers have, requiring them to be effectively on-call for weeks at a time. Workers have complained of increased levels of stress an…

How do you know Biden forcing them back to work has anything to do with the crash?
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