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Money Laundering and AML Compliance

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Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#41

Post by notch898a »

pjkundert wrote: post #35
exbanker wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just factually untrue. AML policies unjustly affect millions of Americans. At US Bank, you can’t deposit cash without an ID which is standard post 2018 or so. Yet go to a US Bank in a low income area, deposit $100 in a family member’s account and they will ask for ID, social security number and your job. US Bank has been involved in multiple money laundering scandals leading to deferred criminal prosecution.…

I'm always gobsmacked at the level of ... jawdropping "Let them eat cake!" self-delusion displayed by some wealthy people. "This hasn't affected me, so it mustn't affect anyone!" The grinding day-to-day slogging, through the mud of irrelevant and useless regulatory burden experienced by the "lesser" classes of civilization (and anyone actually trying to run a small business) is just astonishing. Basically, many peopl…

I thought their response was sarcasm. Surely no one would seriously think it is reasonable to be questioned over the phone over $10k which is what, enough to cover a month of expenses for an upper middle class family in Manhattan or San Francisco?

As for a SAR, lmao. It's illegal for them to tell you if you triggered it, how on earth would you know?

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#42

Post by ClumsyPilot »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #12
pjkundert wrote: post #2

Governor Tarkin: Princess Leia, before your execution, you will join me at a ceremony that will make this battle station operational. No star system will dare oppose the Emperor now. Princess Leia: The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers. Every government and central bank in the world is tightening their grip around the tiniest transactions of their citizenry. In t…

> And then, they wonder why people are being driven to use Cryptocurrency... If only. Normal people are only buying crypto to speculate. They drive the price up to absurd levels and then write it all off as a scam when it corrects. Meanwhile good technology like Monero remains marginalized instead of replacing the USD as it should.

> good technology like Monero remains marginalized instead of replacing the USD as it should.

Imagine you achieve your Crypto-dream, known mass murderers like the head of Wagner or Kadyrov will move money with impunity.

Current system is problematic, but I don't fancy the idea of money being conpletely untouchable by the system of justice

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#43

Post by btilly »

NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #28
irusensei wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is rare. I have a funny passport so some institutions are often probing my life and the source of my funds. The criminal records translated to english (I’m not from an english speaking country, I don’t live or work on an english peaking country) happened to me. I also had a chat with a polish woman who told me that UK banks required documents about her grandparents nationality when she went there for study cir…

> I am convinced xenophobia is alive and well through the financial system. It's really not. You don't make money by unnecessarily turning business away.

It really is.

Go read patio11's AML article again. He gives examples. And says he has personally experienced it.

More importantly he explains why it happens. And expresses a wish for more scrutiny on how AML works in practice, because the common result has some bad effects.

Here is his explanation. Having regulators crack down on you is bad for business. Which they will do if money laundering is found. And money launderers actively want to bounce money between different organizations in different legal jurisdictions. Therefore if someone wants to send money to a different country, particularly if they look like they might be hard to find if regulators decide to ask hard questions, they get arbitrarily increased scrutiny. The result of which is indistinguishable from xenophobia. (Which may also be involved.)

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#44

Post by notch898a »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #42
matheusmoreira wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And then, they wonder why people are being driven to use Cryptocurrency... If only. Normal people are only buying crypto to speculate. They drive the price up to absurd levels and then write it all off as a scam when it corrects. Meanwhile good technology like Monero remains marginalized instead of replacing the USD as it should.

> good technology like Monero remains marginalized instead of replacing the USD as it should. Imagine you achieve your Crypto-dream, known mass murderers like the head of Wagner or Kadyrov will move money with impunity. Current system is problematic, but I don't fancy the idea of money being conpletely untouchable by the system of justice

Yeah then law enforcement would actually have to catch Kadyrov for you know, murdering civilians rather than for moving money. That sounds awful.

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#45

Post by Spooky23 »

pyuser583 wrote: post #18
irusensei wrote: post #4

It is expensive to keep a crime and corruption department on your banking institution. If you are dealing with a millionaire who is related to some oil mogul in Russia you can do your due diligence and Vladimirovich can hire a team of accountants to prove that his business is legit and not at all related to the corporativist oligarchy his uncle runs. Or it might be, but the risk vs reward is good enough to turn a bli…

There’s a really great book called Kleptopia by T. Burgis. It’s about how wealthy oligarchs use the Western legal and banking systems. He points out that the US financial system is squeaky clean. Oligarchs wind up in prison because they think they can pull the crap in New York that they pull in London. But outside the financial sector it’s the 100% opposite. Americas permissive corporate transparency lets assets vani…

Real estate is the ultimate legal grift in the US. The whole tax system is wired up to the benefit of real estate investors.

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#46

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

btilly wrote: post #43
NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am convinced xenophobia is alive and well through the financial system. It's really not. You don't make money by unnecessarily turning business away.

It really is. Go read patio11's AML article again. He gives examples. And says he has personally experienced it. More importantly he explains why it happens. And expresses a wish for more scrutiny on how AML works in practice, because the common result has some bad effects. Here is his explanation. Having regulators crack down on you is bad for business. Which they will do if money laundering is found. And money laun…

>The result of which is indistinguishable from xenophobia.

Yeah, but it's not xenophobia: it's mandatory compliance activity associated with a framework that - if it did not exist - banks would not do. Motives matter. Xenophobia wouldn't be distributed in accordance with weak national finance controls etc.

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#47

Post by yieldcrv »

NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #29
yieldcrv wrote: post #10

Al Capone would have passed KYC

Al Capone would fail KYC just on reputational risk and negative media exposure before we even get into unclear source of wealth.

Everyone can get banked unless they didn't pay overdraft fees (in Chex Systems in some way). All he needs is one bank and brokerage firm for total access to the domestic and international electronic banking system. There are enough around. All the major ones would take his account. Negative media exposure lol, as if this is publicly broadcasted, but even then, those fees would be enticing.

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#48

Post by [deleted] »

cmeacham98 wrote: post #26
irusensei wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think I’ve heard someone calling this shotgun KYC. They will allow you to deposit but as soon as you show signs of using that money they take it as hostage until you prove you are not a criminal.

Common with offshore online casinos: you can deposit and lose your money, but as soon as you try to withdraw winnings the KYC rolls out and you better hope you're not a US citizen because you weren't even supposed to sign up in the first place then.

[deleted]

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#49

Post by mmerlin »

exbanker wrote: post #32

The biggest money launderers are close to those who write the AML policies. One of the most significant money launderers is a famous attorney from Shearman and Sterling in NYC. From my experience, prominent financial executives attempted to engage in blatant laundering of drug money in BVI. These individuals were connected to the attorney and one is a public official appointed by 4 US Presidents. This was 20+ years a…

Thanks to the Wikileaks effect of the internet (rapid info declassification + sharing) more corruption is able to be exposed, and the scale is shocking and enormous.

The hardest part is then trying to change a known-to-be-corrupt system, when those who write the rules always do so in their favour.

Here in Australia we have slid into the bottom 10 percent of global corruption index [0]

Politicians, lawyers, accountants, and realestate agents have conspired to repeatedly prevent AML from being introduced to Australia since 2002.

Whistleblowers get threatened with life-destroying jail terms.

Politicians "retire" then take up cushy directorships with numerous companies they previously wrote seemingly treasonous laws for (dozens of slap-in-the-face-blatant corruption yet it continues on with impunity or any punishment except for maybe losing an election or a gravy train contract).

[0] https://www.transparency.org/en/blog/cpi-2021-corruption-wat...

Re: Money Laundering and AML Compliance

#50

Post by HWR_14 »

exbanker wrote: post #32

The biggest money launderers are close to those who write the AML policies. One of the most significant money launderers is a famous attorney from Shearman and Sterling in NYC. From my experience, prominent financial executives attempted to engage in blatant laundering of drug money in BVI. These individuals were connected to the attorney and one is a public official appointed by 4 US Presidents. This was 20+ years a…

Like, they offered you $1MM (clean) to put $100MM cash in a suitcase and smuggle it through customs? Or to babysit it on a chartered flight and claim it was yours at customs? Because those feel pretty different.
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