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Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

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Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#411

Post by medion »

pphysch wrote: post #147
lb4r wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consequently, this is probably the beginning of a very abrupt end for traditional search.

It's going to eat up a lot of Wikipedia, StackOverflow, Quora, etc. traffic but it doesn't change the reality that often you need a real link to somewhere else on the Internet. And all of that is still going through Google or Bing.

Yes, this is a serious concern. These GPT's have stolen the collective knowledge these places have created, particularly Wikipedia - MS will refactor it and spew it out through a Microsoft portal. In effect, ChatGPT becomes a new window into the 'hand' generated Internet - eventually this window will be a new corporate garden wall. Huge swathes of traffic will be pulled from the likes of Wikipedia, StackOverflow, blogs, etc - basically any public facing source of knowledge/information.

It's not good.

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#412

Post by cwkoss »

jimrandomh wrote: post #101

This is undeniably cool and impressive, but, I think proceeding down this research path, at this pace, is quite irresponsible. The primary effect of OpenAI's work has been to set off an arms race, and the effect of that is that humanity no longer has the ability to make decisions about how fast and how far to go with AGI development. Obviously this isn't a system that's going to recursively self-improve and wipe out…

My beliefs have shifted over the past years, and I now think it is likely that AGIs will be SIGNIFICANTLY more moral than the average human leader. Instinctual survival drives continue to steer the human psyche despite some no longer being adaptive for modern society.

(ex. fame and power tends to make human men act sexually with people who don't consent. there is no reason to ever instill a sexual urge into AGI as a core motivator - further instilling such an urge would harm the AGI's intelligence, making it less effective and comparatively less dangerous).

I now believe the biggest risk to our future related to AGIs is not that AGI's will be immoral or amoral, but rather that capitalists will force AGIs to become greedy for their own gain and end up creating a monster. In absence of consciously trying to instill greed, I think it's unlikely AGIs will become monstrous.

Humanity's best chance, IMO, is to make AI as open as possible and sprint towards AI governance of global resource allocation.

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#413

Post by spixy »

poutine wrote: post #344
basch wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>of course Edge is Chrome under the hood Embrace, Extend. That's the beauty of open source, right? If development and innovation slows, somebody can fork.

Left out the last E there...

that is right, with open source there is no last E

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#414

Post by [deleted] »

LrnByTeach wrote: post #305

Why Google named ChatGPT competitor as “Apprentice Bard”? Here's my take. "Apprentice is Barred from this AI race" is the phrase. "You (OpenAI) Apprentice are Barred from this AI race, because, well you are just an apprentice" To counter Sun Microsystems' dominance in the Java market, IBM named its IDE as "Eclipse."( blocking Sun). PS: To be clear, that is not my personal opinion of OpenAI, I believe OpenAI brought s…

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#415

Post by ekanes »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #388
davesque wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. If Microsoft somehow overtakes Google from the back with Bing and ChatGPT, it'll be the tech coup of the century. And it's so fascinating how Google's position as an AI think tank put them at a tremendous disadvantage. They didn't cut a deal with OpenAI because why should they? After all, they originated much of the research that led to GPT3. But then they didn't really do anything with it at all because they di…

> they didn't really do anything with it at all because they didn't have to. They didn't do anything with it because chatbots are unequivocally a worse business model than the current search paradigm. They cost exponentially more to run and are much harder to organically advertise with without scaring away users by making the chat responses themselves ads. If the future of search is chatbots Google is facing existent…

Dang. You're right. Classic Innovator's Dilemma!

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#416

Post by eklitzke »

ly3xqhl8g9 wrote: post #401
paulpan wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if Microsoft kills itself in the process? At best it's a Pyrrhic victory as both companies sink enormous infra costs to outdo one another. Worst case could be like Nokia acquisition debacle a decade ago when Microsoft desperately tried to re-break into mobile and failed. There was a HN thread on this a while ago where consensus was serving cost ~$0.03-0.05 PER query, which is absolutely huge. Adds more credence t…

It's ~$0.03 per query if you were to buy the compute from AWS/Azure. If you own the datacenters it's probably more around $0.0003, perhaps less.

The profit margins of cloud providers are nowhere close to that. GCP and Azure currently lose money for Google and Microsoft, AWS is profitable but their profit margins are absolutely not 100x.

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#417

Post by revskill »

sn0wf1re wrote: post #393
HDThoreaun wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they didn't really do anything with it at all because they didn't have to. They didn't do anything with it because chatbots are unequivocally a worse business model than the current search paradigm. They cost exponentially more to run and are much harder to organically advertise with without scaring away users by making the chat responses themselves ads. If the future of search is chatbots Google is facing existent…

It reminds me of the Tiktok vs Youtube comparison. Ad revenue was way higher on long format content, but the success of Tiktok means that Youtube now has to pay more to creators, even if their margins are lower. AI as search is lower margin but Google will need to implement it just to stay relevant.

It's really hard to move fast on a Python codebase i think. The solution should be rewriting it .

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#418

Post by robinsonb5 »

JohnFen wrote: post #278
osigurdson wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still think google search is pretty good. I try to use DDG but I almost always end up using g! in the query to return the google results. My understanding is DDG uses Bing (could be wrong). I don't think there is a better traditional search engine than google however.

DDG is a search aggregator, and uses a bunch of different engines behind the scenes. One of them is Bing. They provide a list of the engines they use. Personally, I find DDG gives me the best results of all the engines I've tried, including Google. But plenty of other people have different experiences. My hypothesis is that it depends on what you're searching for and how you write the search query.

I have a suspicion that Google's search results are of much better quality if you allow them to track you. I still do (mostly out of laziness, I have to admit) - and I frequently find myself cursing at the uselessness of DuckDuckGo's results and using Google instead.

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#419

Post by luckylion »

zzzeek wrote: post #324
epups wrote: post #80

This is a potentially momentous occasion here. Microsoft is betting hard that they can mount a challenge to Google, and I think ChatGPT can credibly attempt that. The answer from Google so far is weak. The thought that Bing may actually overtake Google would be hilarious a few months ago, and now it looks... possible?

they'd have to get ChatGPT to stop spewing up made up bullshit and fake academic citations first, which I think is a bit of a bigger problem than many seem to be considering. the outcome will still be hilarious though, so it's win win for the onlookers I guess edit: all the responses here who think the garbage is "just fine, at least it's not SEO" are similarly hilarious. as though SEO would not be polluting the AI a…

> they'd have to get ChatGPT to stop spewing up made up bullshit and fake academic citations firs

Why? The alternative is reading your way through SEO spam (and soon: reading yourself through ChatGPT-generated SEO spam), which is often just as wrong. Source: am working for SEOs.

Re: Microsoft announces new Bing and Edge browser powered by upgraded ChatGPT AI

#420

Post by speedgoose »

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #191
braingenious wrote: post #183

I’m really curious as to how on Earth did Google fumble the ball on this stuff? It’s hilarious that their search offering has been so bad for so long that the new Big Idea in Search is “What if you searched something and the returned result wasn’t garbage?”

I don't see it as fumbling the ball. The technology is brand new and Google just yesterday announced they are currently testing bringing this to chat too. Just like Apple does not release folding phones and rear screens first, the major player does not need to be the first mover. OpenAI has grabbed all the publicity but this entire time Google research has been publishing their own work in the field and they have sho…

Meanwhile ChatGPT had 100 million users and 13 million daily users in January.

They accumulated a lot of data and while I’m sure the Google engineers are very competent and fast, their large scale testing may not produce as much useful data.

I think Google will manage in the long term, but for the current race it looks difficult.

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