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ThinkPad T420

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Re: ThinkPad T420

#41

Post by diggernet »

mindslight wrote: post #39

Does anybody have a recommendation to a source of consistently good replacement batteries for the X230? The last (/first) time I tried buying an aftermarket battery, the thing lasted perhaps 6-12 months and then turned into trash. I've got it in my head to do some DIY cell swaps some day, but it's so far down on the list I'd settle for an off the shelf answer if I knew I could avoid fraud.

Check out DuracellDirect [1]. I had the same concerns as you when I needed new Thinkpad batteries in 2019. Absolutely no complaints. They are still going strong today.

[1] https://www.duracelldirect.com/

Re: ThinkPad T420

#42

Post by romeoblade »

NoZebra120vClip wrote: post #37
romeoblade wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ended up going with a second hand T580 last year myself. It was a hard choice between the T480 or the T580, but I've been extremely happy with my decision. It's now maxed out with 64GB ram, and a second SSD in the WWAN slot. I'm running Debian Sid with ZFS root on it.

Cool, I chose a brand-new T580 from the factory in 2018. I had nowhere near the resource demands that you have, so I am happy to be chugging along with the i5, 128GB SSD, 16GiB RAM. Two upgrades I probably didn't even need are a touchscreen and a medium-size second battery, but otherwise, it's perfect. Initially I put CentOS on it, which was really broken, so I swapped in Fedora which worked great. The T580 is RHEL-c…

The RAM was a lucky find. Amazon warehouse had an open box 64GB kit for $180ish, which the price of a new 32GB kit at the time iirc. I figured I'd take a chance on it, and ran memtest on it for 32 hours or so and it checked out. I tend to run a lot of VM's and docker containers to minimize the need to VPN and use the corporate test/dev environment.

Mine has the i7 and the touch screen, I ended up I talking the seller down to $800 BIN on eBay and at the time it still had a year left on the warranty.

All in all, RAM and extra HDD I'm only in it for $1200 which I think was great deal for the last Lenovo Thinkpad that doesn't have soldiered RAM.

Re: ThinkPad T420

#43

Post by lawgimenez »

beAbU wrote: post #29
lawgimenez wrote: post #13

I just bought a second hand T480 last week and installed Fedora in it. I'm loving it but the resolution 1336x768 is underwhelming.

You can get a much brighter 1080p panel for it for not a lot of money. Do a search on reddit for T480 display upgrades. The install itself is pretty easy, and it is so much better than the shitty 768 panels that most of these secondhand 480s came with. Edit: typo

Wow I didn't know this, thanks!

Re: ThinkPad T420

#44

Post by deeesstoronto »

mindslight wrote: post #39

Does anybody have a recommendation to a source of consistently good replacement batteries for the X230? The last (/first) time I tried buying an aftermarket battery, the thing lasted perhaps 6-12 months and then turned into trash. I've got it in my head to do some DIY cell swaps some day, but it's so far down on the list I'd settle for an off the shelf answer if I knew I could avoid fraud.

The big disadvantage of the T420s/430s is the s batteries do not use standard cells. The T420/430, X220/230 (and I assume w series) battery packs use standard 18650 cells.

In the x220 battery packs the controllers are not locked down hard (the later x230 batteries appear locked down and cannot be reset the same way... likely need either special software or may be able to connect directly to flash). The controller (bq8030 or bq2090 or similar) nvram can be dumped and written using the laptops built-in battery management smbus.

I recently re-celled mine; dump the calibration nvram before starting (not the end of the world if you didn't). Buy whatever power tool battery is on clearance. Swap the 18650 li-ion cells. For a cheap and cheerful spot welder, you can buy a board with some FETs to switch power from a car battery. Restore the firmware. Run Lenovo battery calibration.

Lots of info at http://www.karosium.com/2016/08/hacking-bq8030-with-sanyo-fi... (no affiliation, but found it a great resource!). If you didn't save your firmware or starting from a toasted battery, compare and contrast to calibration dumps found online. TI also has general specs available on a similar controller.

The battery controller will set a bit to disable the battery when the cell voltages get out of sync when removing/adding cells (other ways of dealing with this too.... holding controller in reset, voltage in parallel). Restoring the nvram calibration data resets this. Finding most data in the dump was relatively easy by comparing to battery statistics available through ThinkPad tools. I have detailed notes and posted to comments at above site.

There's some debate on different cell charging profiles as the original cells were 4.1v versus modern chemistry being 4.2v and so potentially will end up undercharged... but I've had great success just dropping in and don't feel the need to squeeze out more capacity.

Took an afternoon to do....not necessarily worth it, but was a fun project to figure out. My 9-cell is back to 10 hours of runtime/way better than any aftermarket I've tried.

Re: ThinkPad T420

#45

Post by steponlego »

culopatin wrote: post #24

What is this post? Are we just posting a spec sheet and making claims in the title now? Why is the last one? I don’t think so. I have some thinkpads, I have the revered x220, it was great until I used a good current laptop. Newer ones are just better. It’s ok if you want to use older hardware, no one is saying you shouldn’t, but go out in the world and be honest. New one Doesn’t get as hot, battery actually lasts lik…

Heh, iToddler.

Re: ThinkPad T420

#47

Post by mindslight »

deeesstoronto wrote: post #44
mindslight wrote: post #39

Does anybody have a recommendation to a source of consistently good replacement batteries for the X230? The last (/first) time I tried buying an aftermarket battery, the thing lasted perhaps 6-12 months and then turned into trash. I've got it in my head to do some DIY cell swaps some day, but it's so far down on the list I'd settle for an off the shelf answer if I knew I could avoid fraud.

The big disadvantage of the T420s/430s is the s batteries do not use standard cells. The T420/430, X220/230 (and I assume w series) battery packs use standard 18650 cells. In the x220 battery packs the controllers are not locked down hard (the later x230 batteries appear locked down and cannot be reset the same way... likely need either special software or may be able to connect directly to flash). The controller (bq…

That's much more of an explanation than I expected from my comment, thank you very much!

Reading between the lines, I think you've confirmed what I figured I had to do to replace the cells in my X230 - apply voltage across each of the cells as I swap them out, so the chip doesn't lock down.

But now I'm wondering if I can simply get a busted X220 battery to repair and use in my X230. The first search result says that it fits, but the X230 won't charge it due to DRM crap. But it also mentions a modded BIOS to get around this, and I'm running coreboot, so it seems that avenue might still be open - assuming it's really the "BIOS" and not the EC (embedded controller) chip checking.

BTW is gutting power tool batteries really a practical way to obtain reliable 18650 cells? It seems like that would be an expensive source, even on sale. But I admit my experience is with Dewalt 20V, which have their own premium. I figured I'd be hitting up the vape community to see their recommended sources when I got down to it.

Re: ThinkPad T420

#48

Post by mindslight »

diggernet wrote: post #41
mindslight wrote: post #39

Does anybody have a recommendation to a source of consistently good replacement batteries for the X230? The last (/first) time I tried buying an aftermarket battery, the thing lasted perhaps 6-12 months and then turned into trash. I've got it in my head to do some DIY cell swaps some day, but it's so far down on the list I'd settle for an off the shelf answer if I knew I could avoid fraud.

Check out DuracellDirect [1]. I had the same concerns as you when I needed new Thinkpad batteries in 2019. Absolutely no complaints. They are still going strong today. [1] https://www.duracelldirect.com/

Thank you for the recommendation. I'm a bit surprised by the brand!

Re: ThinkPad T420

#49

Post by deeesstoronto »

mindslight wrote: post #47
deeesstoronto wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big disadvantage of the T420s/430s is the s batteries do not use standard cells. The T420/430, X220/230 (and I assume w series) battery packs use standard 18650 cells. In the x220 battery packs the controllers are not locked down hard (the later x230 batteries appear locked down and cannot be reset the same way... likely need either special software or may be able to connect directly to flash). The controller (bq…

That's much more of an explanation than I expected from my comment, thank you very much! Reading between the lines, I think you've confirmed what I figured I had to do to replace the cells in my X230 - apply voltage across each of the cells as I swap them out, so the chip doesn't lock down. But now I'm wondering if I can simply get a busted X220 battery to repair and use in my X230. The first search result says that…

The x220 battery definitely works with the x230 but requires the DRM patch. I'm running an x230 mainboard in what is otherwise an x220. It's an EC not BIOS path so should work with coreboot. Files at https://github.com/hamishcoleman/thinkpad-ec

While swapping cells, just be careful to match voltage and severely limit current to avoid any danger/excitement. Sure you can find some forum posts on this. Also, the new and old cells must be brought very close in voltage as discrepancies are flagged disabling the battery. This also goes for between cells but allowable differences are larger. I think this battery has 3s3p configuration.

I've bought quality 18650 cells online 10 for about $100CAD for a x220 battery rebuild. More recently got 2x 2Ah 18v Ryobi packs which yeilded 10x cells total for $29CAD on clearance at Home Depot....

Re: ThinkPad T420

#50

Post by steponlego »

thinknubpad wrote: post #35
goosedragons wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's essentially just SATA with some extra proprietary bits for adding a second battery there instead and a thingy to make it easier to pop out.

Oh cool, I didn't realize they made battery packs to fit in there. Have you ever seen a pinout listed anywhere?

Browse the site I linked, it shows you all the peripherals you can install. One is just a drawer, heh. I usually keep a cigarillo in there just for fun.
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