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Bard and new AI features in Search

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Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#441

Post by sekai »

asim wrote: post #224

People forget that Larry Page's ultimate goal was to have Google predict what you wanted before you even asked for it. This isn't about hype. This isn't about beating the competition. This is about delivering on a 3 decade dream that's now coming to fruition and Sundar just happens to be the one leading the org as it manifests in the real world. We're going to end up with 10+ vertically integrated AI solutions like t…

> Google will be core infrastructure for the world and this thing will be an assistant to everyone who buys into the Google ecosystem

Pretty optimistic, considering things Google "delivered" in the past 5 to 10 years.

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#442

Post by wejick »

wiremine wrote: post #232

I agree this is bland corporate speak. But it reminded me of a question that's been floating around: A number of pundits, here on HN and elsewhere, keep referring to these large language models are "google killers." This just doesn't make sense to me. It feels like Google can easily pivot its ad engine to work with the AI-driven chat systems. It can augment answers with links to additional sources of information, be…

rather than google killers, I would say it is SEO or publishers killers. There will be less traffic to websites or blogs, certain type of websites will be impacted most than the other. in fact google will have more way to recommend and curate content in their way.

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#443

Post by visarga »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #417
shawntan wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like the earlier responses said, if it is retrieving information from an external data source, that would be a much easier way to update things. REALM ( https://arxiv.org/abs/2002.08909 ) comes to mind as an example of active work in this area. Updating a monolithic LLM seems like a harder problem at the moment, and probably would fall under the umbrella of "continual learning", though that sub-field would have their…

> Like the earlier responses said, if it is retrieving information from an external data source I was under the impression it went through like a multi-month long ultra expensive training process involving many GPUs on terabytes of data "snapshotted" point in time. Is it possible to do this at a smaller scale once a day at the end of the day with "all new content scraped from the Internet nightly"?

Not effectively, because you probably can't return to language pre-training after multi-task fine-tuning and RLHF. Stage 1 has to go before stages 2 and 3. So they would need to fine-tune a stage 1 model and re-apply stages 2 and 3.

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#444

Post by camgunz »

jjcon wrote: post #273
brap wrote: post #206

I’m curious to hear why Google isn’t going to win in this AI arms race. The way I see it, Google: * is effectively the gateway to the internet, owning the most popular website in the world, mobile OS, and browser * has infinite LIVE data, both unstructured and structured (knowledge graph) * has infinite compute resources * employs the world’s best AI scientists and invests heavily in AI * has decade(s) of experience…

That may all be the case but then why has Google been failing to innovate and also maintain anything the past few years? The past fews years we’ve seen Google products die and deteriorate. Search has gotten worse, they’ve killed dozens of products and services (even ones that they promised would be around for the long haul). GPhotos is no longer free (after putting most competitors out of business). Google lack any i…

I'm still salty about Google Reader, but they've innovated (Bard is the subject in the Op and a pretty big AI innovation) and maintained (Gmail, Docs, Chrome, Golang, Android) a bunch of stuff.

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#445

Post by rossjudson »

cactusplant7374 wrote: post #218
dizzydes wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. ChatGPT have made a decent go of it on a much smaller budget 2. Wall St tends to be very forgiving when the investment is something with a strong a moat as AI. Metaverse is an example of what happens when they don’t believe… 3. With a few exceptions like weather, their current searches provide links to static pages others have built, so much of their understanding and analysis is going to waste. Giving custom resu…

Didn’t Altman respond to Elon on Twitter and say an interaction cost 1 cent?

If Google handles 10 billion searches per day (guessing), what does that work out to?

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#446

Post by rchaud »

ekanes wrote: post #281
asim wrote: post #224

People forget that Larry Page's ultimate goal was to have Google predict what you wanted before you even asked for it. This isn't about hype. This isn't about beating the competition. This is about delivering on a 3 decade dream that's now coming to fruition and Sundar just happens to be the one leading the org as it manifests in the real world. We're going to end up with 10+ vertically integrated AI solutions like t…

Meh. Enthusiasm about Larry Page's ultimate goals and dreams went out the window right about the time don't be evil went out the window.

At this point in SV history, harkening back to what a founder said as an anonymous PhD in his pre-billionaire 20s, sounds a lot like when people talk about "what the Founding Fathers wanted".

Nothing is set in stone, and the world is very different from the Web 1.0 era in which Google formed.

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#447

Post by Hermel »

xnx wrote: post #432
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #304

Question for AI experts out there: ChatGPT is awesome, but it is obviously hamstrung by the fact that it crawled the web at the end of 2021, so all of its data is essentially "frozen" and it doesn't "know" of any topics that occurred after 2021. Seems to me like the next "holy grail" in large language models is building a model that can be continually updated. If Google can achieve that, I think they could leapfrog O…

I believe Google has dealt with a similar problem early in its history. In the early 2000's Google's PageRank values had to be calculated all at once (approximately monthly). Later they were able to move to a continuous/incremental/rolling update.

Exactly, so Page and Brin might think that they can pull the same trick again.

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#448

Post by whitepaint »

stcroixx wrote: post #392

They burned a bridge already and it's too late now. People will be less likely to use whatever AI they release as we'll just assume it's trying to financially exploit us like they did with search and gmail. Mass adoption will never happen because of their spoiled reputation. Google will not be at the center of the AI future. Watch them get even more user hostile as they realize this and cling to their ad business eve…

As long as it is at least as good as ChatGPT, I will definitely use it.

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#449

Post by febeling »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #304

Question for AI experts out there: ChatGPT is awesome, but it is obviously hamstrung by the fact that it crawled the web at the end of 2021, so all of its data is essentially "frozen" and it doesn't "know" of any topics that occurred after 2021. Seems to me like the next "holy grail" in large language models is building a model that can be continually updated. If Google can achieve that, I think they could leapfrog O…

One more question: apparently LLMs model the human language as well as the knowledge encoded in it? Aren't those separate concerns? Maybe those can't be separated and that's the reason?

Re: Bard and new AI features in Search

#450

Post by guelo »

alain94040 wrote: post #388
wiremine wrote: post #232

I agree this is bland corporate speak. But it reminded me of a question that's been floating around: A number of pundits, here on HN and elsewhere, keep referring to these large language models are "google killers." This just doesn't make sense to me. It feels like Google can easily pivot its ad engine to work with the AI-driven chat systems. It can augment answers with links to additional sources of information, be…

Those new language models are "Google killers" because they reset all the assumptions that people have made about search for several decades. Imagine that people start using those chat bots massively as a replacement for Google search. Then the notion of keyword disappears. Google AdSense becomes mostly irrelevant. Of course, Google is a giant today with a history of machine learning innovation. So they have a good c…

Google could ask the llm what products or services would help with the question and show ads for that. Just tried it and it worked pretty well.

> Me: 8 year old girl birthday party ideas

> Chatgpt:

> Me: what products or services could I buy for it

> Chatgpt: craft party: craft supplies such as beads, glue, paint, and fabric - scavengerhunt: prizes for the scavenger hunt and decorations - dance party: Hire a DJ or a dance instructor, and purchase party lights and decorations

Though in reality Google already has highly tuned models for extracting ads out of any prompt

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