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As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

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Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#811

Post by naasking »

jack_pp wrote: post #794
naasking wrote: post #770

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Something CAN be real and beyond current scientific understanding I think you're reading that wrong. "Beyond scientific understanding" doesn't mean "beyond current scientific understanding", it actually means, "beyond any possible scientific understanding". So a supernatural phenomenon would defeat any possible attempt at characterizing it scientifically.

Have you considered that you're interpreting it wrong? Go back in time with self-replicating, able to construct themselves to predefined structures, nanobots and you'll have supernatural powers that "violate" scientific understanding of the time. Doesn't mean it can't be explained. It is true hubris and actually kind of sad to think we know all laws of nature and nothing new could stump us and our cherished laws of n…

The definition of "supernatural" has nothing to do with scientific understanding at any particular time, it's about whether a scientific understanding is possible even in principle. Deities and souls are not amenable to scientific understanding even in principle, that's why they're considered supernatural. Observed phenomena that defy current understanding don't qualify.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#812

Post by msm_ »

naasking wrote: post #757
reso wrote: post #596

Mick West's breakdowns of the Pentagon UAP videos was the nail in the coffin of this era of UFO hype for me. https://youtu.be/Le7Fqbsrrm8?t=665 These were supposed to be the smoking gun evidence. UFO believers inside the DoD and as high up as US Senators fought for years to get them declassified. As soon as they were public, they were all quickly identified as sensor glare, bokeh, or mis-understood perspective. More…

> Mick West's breakdowns of the Pentagon UAP videos was the nail in the coffin of this era of UFO hype for me. I honestly don't know why anyone thinks West has managed to explain everything. These objects were picked up by multiple sensor systems which wouldn't show the same artifacts. Of the hundreds to thousands of reports, the DoD analysis managed to explain all except something like 14. There's still something to…

> There's still something to left to explain here.

This is like saying "of the hundreds to thousands of firefox segfaults, the Mozilla programmers managed to explain all except something like 14.

Of course, there's something left to explain and improve. But Occam's razor applies, and we prefer simpler answers (like a sensor quirk).

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#813

Post by naasking »

mikrotikker wrote: post #802
naasking wrote: post #765

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The easy explaination is they are advanced military craft. That's not easy at all given the alleged capabilities of these objects tracked across multiple sensor systems. An easier explanation is actually some kind of active sensor spoofing.

But that would also infer some kind of parapsychology effects to make the pilots see things. Or maybe a better version of the Havana syndrome gun?

All of these sensor systems operate on the electromagnetic spectrum, including our eyes. A device that creates a broad spectrum EM artifact seems conceivable.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#814

Post by low_tech_love »

ALittleLight wrote: post #638
KingOfCoders wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they release the videos we will know! If they release the radar data we will know! If they release ...

The original article cites pilots, Congress-people, and members of the intelligence services saying there are hundreds of credible instances of apparently advanced technology documented by eyewitness testimony, video, radar, infrared, etc. Seems completely different than your parody here.

Exactly, plus my second-cousin and the neighbor of my father-in-law also swear they saw it.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#815

Post by naasking »

msm_ wrote: post #812
naasking wrote: post #757

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mick West's breakdowns of the Pentagon UAP videos was the nail in the coffin of this era of UFO hype for me. I honestly don't know why anyone thinks West has managed to explain everything. These objects were picked up by multiple sensor systems which wouldn't show the same artifacts. Of the hundreds to thousands of reports, the DoD analysis managed to explain all except something like 14. There's still something to…

> There's still something to left to explain here. This is like saying "of the hundreds to thousands of firefox segfaults, the Mozilla programmers managed to explain all except something like 14. Of course, there's something left to explain and improve. But Occam's razor applies, and we prefer simpler answers (like a sensor quirk).

Occam's razor does not let you dismiss observations just because they don't neatly fit into your boxes. It costs nothing to collect the data for the time when a better explanation arises.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#816

Post by nirvgorilla »

dtx1 wrote: post #776
dTal wrote: post #755

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I notice "argument from personal ignorance" is common in "believer" circles (not just of aliens, but of all kinds of conspiracy theories). If you happen to be well educated enough to provide a detailed explanation of why a particular thing they've said doesn't hold water, it's frustratingly common for them to fall back on "well I'm not an expert, I don't know all the details, I'm just asking questions." Somehow it ne…

But that is not my argument. I am not an expert in Seismic Sensors, yet I believe the experts that tell me this happened. The military Experts directly witnessing the Nimitz events and the sensors they are trained on tell me something really extraordinary happened. The best "ordinary event misinterpreted" explanation comes from a game developer turned professional skeptic that ignores a heap of evidence and direct te…

Hi I said voice. Why haven't you added and called yet?

Oh, a conspiracy theorist keyboard warrior who can't orally defend the BULLCRAP they spew on the internet in real-time voice chat.

Funny how that works.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#817

Post by mlindner »

stevenhuang wrote: post #659
mlindner wrote: post #569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's amazing how many people believe that aliens are constantly flitting across our skies. I constantly wonder what the psyche is like of people who believe that kind of thing and what makes them so confident in it despite all the counter-veiling evidence. It seems to fool some of the most intelligent people the most and I'm not quite sure why.

All of that falls flat when you assume the phenomenon itself is intelligent. So it's no surprise in the age of smartphones we don't see increased footage. The evidence is out there. Don't be surprised you don't get it when you don't look into it and evaluate the evidence for yourself. If you're interested, see UFOs: Generals, Pilots, and Government Officials Go on the Record by Leslie Kean.

I had and lost interest years and years ago. It's the same thing it's always been. A bunch of made-for-TV drama nonsense.

The people that believe this stuff are the same types that think 9/11 was an inside job, that we didn't land on the moon, that 5G or wifi cause mental problems, or believe in crystal power. No matter how much you show them they'll continue to believe in their myth. It's a replacement for religion.

Oh and there's a decent amount to be made on talk series sales and book sales if you can cough up an "I saw an alien" story that sounds good and make some good money by selling to the above audience.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#818

Post by anon7725 »

wpietri wrote: post #743
anon7725 wrote: post #685

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's no reason to think FTL travel is possible This seems like fairly closed thinking. We’ve observed strange behavior at the quantum level. We have plausible theories of wormholes and multiverses. It’s conceivable that some civilization has assembled FTL travel from these and other natural phenomena yet unknown. > it's economically unreasonable to think some species is going to invest in generation ships We’re…

This is exactly how the spiritualists sounded in their day. They had facially plausible theories of the phenomena they claimed to observe with no actual evidence described in ways that fit in with the gaps in understanding of the moment. I too consume a lot of science fiction, but it's important to remember that it's just writers making shit up. Perhaps FTL is possible. Perhaps angel are real. Both are things people…

Did you happen to notice the phrases “it’s conceivable” and “perhaps” in my reply? I’m not making any categorical assertions. I think people who make categorical assertions in the negative regarding other life in the universe and its potential capabilities are engaging in scientism.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#819

Post by l33tman »

FWIW, the guy who wrote this article, Ryan Graves, is one of the aviators who flew and witnessed these, in addition to David Frevor (also mentioned elsewhere in this thread). Ryan was interviewed by Lex Fridman, a very good talk I think that felt balanced on the subject.

Re: As a US Navy fighter pilot, I witnessed unidentified anomalous phenomena

#820

Post by dtx1 »

nirvgorilla wrote: post #816
dtx1 wrote: post #776

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that is not my argument. I am not an expert in Seismic Sensors, yet I believe the experts that tell me this happened. The military Experts directly witnessing the Nimitz events and the sensors they are trained on tell me something really extraordinary happened. The best "ordinary event misinterpreted" explanation comes from a game developer turned professional skeptic that ignores a heap of evidence and direct te…

Hi I said voice. Why haven't you added and called yet? Oh, a conspiracy theorist keyboard warrior who can't orally defend the BULLCRAP they spew on the internet in real-time voice chat. Funny how that works.

> Funny how that works.

You forgot to add an address where to send you an invoice for my time. Funny how that works

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