Live data from Hacker News

Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

matduggan.com

41–50 of 279 posts

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#41
Well it depends on the kind of business you are running.

It seems that nowadays software companies mostly work on modularized toy problems that new grads can solve effectively.

If you go to the chemical industry that is not the case. Layoffs in senior personnel will bite you within months.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're being a bit uncharitable and jaded here. For many, events like these are actually the catalyst that causes one to "grow up", which is what the author is conveying.

You know who was a bit uncharitable? The people saying “okay boomer” to the Bobs of the world when they kindly tried to share their experience.

I'm curious about this. My experience is that people in my age bracket (early 20s) have been saying "okay boomer" to the people telling us that being in your 20s and 30s is about hustling to show loyalty to your company, showing up at the office five days a week, ingratiating yourself with your boss, spending late nights at the office and being buddy-buddy with all your coworkers. I have never ever witnessed anyone employing this phrase as a response to someone's pessimism about the capitalist society we live in.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#43

I think Amazon, Google, and Meta workers should band together and get funding to start competitors to these companies. If there were some smart investors, that would be a great way to start a new company.

The thing is they kept everyone from the 2-5 main teams that actually run these companies. And what sucks even more is those people don't know that they are so critical and worth millions if not billions each.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. Nearly everyone I know left college doe-eyed and ready to dedicate a piece of their soul to their shiny new job. Everyone learned otherwise one person at a time. Some worked for “we’re all a family” companies and were able to remain innocent ignorants till the day the axe fell.

> Absolutely. Nearly everyone I know left college doe-eyed and ready to dedicate a piece of their soul to their shiny new job When did you graduate college? In the social media era, the sentiment has been more about "fuck you, pay me" and "H.R. is not your friend" type ideology. This is especially true in recent years, where a lot of college graduates have been exposed to years of /r/antiwork in their daily Reddit br…

This business about “fuck capitalism” and so on is also infantile, just in the opposite direction.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#45

This place isn't your home, these people aren't your friends and your executive leadership would run you over with their cars if you stood between them and revenue growth. Your relationship to work changes forever. You will never again believe that you are "critical" to the company or that the company is interested in you as a person. This has always always been the case. Grow up.

I think you're being a bit uncharitable and jaded here. For many, events like these are actually the catalyst that causes one to "grow up", which is what the author is conveying.

I agree.

IMO its worth mentioning the reality of the employeecorporation relationship because MANY companies in both tech and outside of tech have long tried to sell employees (particularly junior ones) on the idea that the company is a big family (without really acting like one beyond a very superficial level, eg. enjoy the free costco snacks, and or catered lunches/dinners when you're here for 12 hour days building value for the family!).

When you're a bit more experienced its easy to be more realistic about this relationship due to seeing that lie revealed a couple of times on a personal level, but that doesn't mean its not worth pointing out and talking about the lie.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#46

This is incredibly dumb. > The downsized companies, however, were outperformed consistently by the nondownsized ones during the initial two years following the downsizing. Can you think of any confounding factors in this analysis? How do you control for important factors like, say: whether the board is in enough financial trouble to downsize ?

Don't forget the next bit, "by the third year, these differences became statistically nonsignificant". So the layoffs... worked?

> So the layoffs... worked?

How does that follow? The conclusion would be that both the companies and workers suffered unnecessarily for 2 years, with no long-term benefit afterward to the layoffs. In other words, you should just ride out the downtimes instead of panicking.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#47

This place isn't your home, these people aren't your friends and your executive leadership would run you over with their cars if you stood between them and revenue growth. Your relationship to work changes forever. You will never again believe that you are "critical" to the company or that the company is interested in you as a person. This has always always been the case. Grow up.

This is true, but I think it's misplaced to bitterly place this on the individual.

I have worked at multiple companies than have disingenously referred to themselves as "family," always talking about "supporting your growth here," etc. It's just outright dishonest and for whatever reason it's the industry standard. Can't blame people for taking it at face value for a few years.

And honestly, one generation ago (and in certain fields like police), your work is a permanent group of supporters. It's not like such a thing is impossible.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#48

If they don't work, it's probably because they are too late. Every company I've worked at has had a bunch of people who don't actually work. One example: I was talking to someone at a social event and they was complaining that her company had laid off so many people they was doing the work of 3. They then went on to say that they was running two fantasy football leagues. I asked them what kind of computer they had at…

Maybe they ran the two leagues together with two colleagues before ;)

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#49
"In addition, nearly one-third of the executives thought their companies terminated the wrong person at least 20% of the time, and approximately an additional quarter indicated that their companies made the wrong decision 10% of the time."

Within corporate decision-making, this rate is actually "fucking genius" level. This article doesn't say what it thinks it says.

Re: Layoffs Are Cruel and Don't Work

#50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know who was a bit uncharitable? The people saying “okay boomer” to the Bobs of the world when they kindly tried to share their experience.

I'm curious about this. My experience is that people in my age bracket (early 20s) have been saying "okay boomer" to the people telling us that being in your 20s and 30s is about hustling to show loyalty to your company, showing up at the office five days a week, ingratiating yourself with your boss, spending late nights at the office and being buddy-buddy with all your coworkers. I have never ever witnessed anyone e…

Trying to make it about capitalism is also silly. Those rant and rave about that have no alternative to offer. At best they suggest Scandavian style welfare capitalism, which has capitalism right there in the name, but call it socialism because it sounds cooler.

They should grow up too.

Post reply on HN