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The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

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Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#111

Post by mattpallissard »

photochemsyn wrote: post #19

A remarkable amount of the fertilizer applied via modern industrial farming practices is just wasted: > "According to an average of 13 global databases from 10 data sources, in 2010, 161 teragrams of nitrogen were applied to agricultural crops, but only 73 teragrams of nitrogen made it to the harvested crop. A total of 86 teragrams of nitrogen was wasted, perhaps ending up in the water, air, or soil. The new research…

> A remarkable amount of the fertilizer applied via modern industrial farming practices is just wasted:

Hmm, the fact that there is waste totally unsurprising given some of nitrogen deliverey methods (like anhydrous ammonia). But those numbers are really high.

> water, air, or soil

Ah, but if it's still in the soil that could probably account for a big chunk of it that would eventually get used

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#112

Post by mikeyouse »

knewter wrote: post #95
ceejayoz wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putin's motivations predate the war, too; the invasion of Crimea was in 2014, and before that was Georgia in 2008.

I always find it interesting when people being up the 2014 Ukraine situation without referencing the call from Victoria Nuland discussing who the US was going to put in charge ("surprisingly", those ended up being the government the people elected) https://odysee.com/@AdamFitzgerald:2/Victoria-Nuland-Phone-C...

Likely because people who know anything about the region know that that supposedly damning call happened after three months of violent protests against the most corrupt government in recent European history.. the reference to Klitchko being made deputy PM means it was recorded after Jan 26th which was when Yanukovych was trying everything to stay in power, including bringing opposition leaders into his government (and working with Russian intelligence to bug US diplomatic phones). He was doing so because many regional offices had already been taken over by protesters and his police forces had already shot several people. The leader who the US diplomats were talking about was already a popular opposition leader, so it's entirely unsurprising that Yatsenyuk was part of government post-Maidan.

I think I'm mostly annoyed with these dumb conspiracy theories because they deny agency to the millions of people who actually cast out a criminal and democratically elected their own leadership. "hurr durr, the CIA did it"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Euromaidan_regional_state...

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#113

Post by [deleted] »

Scoundreller wrote: post #109
randomdata wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We do. Perhaps you may not recognize our lingo. For example, around here we humorously refer to wheat as 'poverty grass' because there is no money in growing it but recognize it as a necessity to keep in the rotation for the ecological health benefits it provides.

There’s money in growing it, but usually where nothing else profitably grows, which is a lot of places. Hugely mechanized though which makes it work when you have enough crop land. But yeah, $/hectare yield is going to be low.

[deleted]

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#114

Post by ceejayoz »

knewter wrote: post #95
ceejayoz wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putin's motivations predate the war, too; the invasion of Crimea was in 2014, and before that was Georgia in 2008.

I always find it interesting when people being up the 2014 Ukraine situation without referencing the call from Victoria Nuland discussing who the US was going to put in charge ("surprisingly", those ended up being the government the people elected) https://odysee.com/@AdamFitzgerald:2/Victoria-Nuland-Phone-C...

The aggression in Georgia long predates that call, and the US expressing a preference in an election is hardly unusual. Are we to believe Putin didn't have a preference in the Ukrainian elections?

Nothing in the call transcript (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957) strikes me as unusual in this scenario. The "fuck the EU" caused a few tut-tut waves.

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#115

Post by Scoundreller »

sleton38234234 wrote: post #84
photochemsyn wrote: post #19

A remarkable amount of the fertilizer applied via modern industrial farming practices is just wasted: > "According to an average of 13 global databases from 10 data sources, in 2010, 161 teragrams of nitrogen were applied to agricultural crops, but only 73 teragrams of nitrogen made it to the harvested crop. A total of 86 teragrams of nitrogen was wasted, perhaps ending up in the water, air, or soil. The new research…

Well, that explains why our water is so high in nitrates. I've been looking into our local water supply. Out of the over 200 contaminants, the one that exceeds the EWG's limit by the most margin is nitrates which is said to come from fertilizer run off.

A lot of that can be from intensive animal farming.

Really bad in New Zealand with all the dairy production.

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#116

Post by [deleted] »

Scoundreller wrote: post #109
randomdata wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We do. Perhaps you may not recognize our lingo. For example, around here we humorously refer to wheat as 'poverty grass' because there is no money in growing it but recognize it as a necessity to keep in the rotation for the ecological health benefits it provides.

There’s money in growing it, but usually where nothing else profitably grows, which is a lot of places. Hugely mechanized though which makes it work when you have enough crop land. But yeah, $/hectare yield is going to be low.

[deleted]

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#118

Post by Scoundreller »

ajmurmann wrote: post #105
Waterluvian wrote: post #2

Few things have a single cause, but I think it's not outlandish to hypothesize that potential pending famines could be driven by a fertilizer shortage, driven by Russia's invasion and global economic issues, driven by the pandemic. Maybe this is obvious to those smarter than I, but I'm beginning to have a sinking sense that direct deaths by SARS-COV2 will be a shockingly small minority of total deaths caused by the p…

Well, 20.8% of goal potash production comes from Russia and another 18% from Belarus. It's a key ingredients in making fertilizer. There is your single cause. Source: https://www.nrcan.gc.ca/our-natural-resources/minerals-minin...

Have they stopped producing?

Don’t think any of the big buyers are resisting purchase from those two countries.

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#119

Post by randomdata »

mattpallissard wrote: post #101
sleton38234234 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crop diversity is great. And you also need lots of organic matter to go on top of the soil: to build life in the soil. that's much better than trying to duct tape the matter with fertilizer.

> Crop diversity is great. Crop rotation has been standard practice my entire life. One of the many kickers though is soybeans are the fallback crop for really wet springs. Many crops need to be planted by a certain date or the growing season will be too short. Soybeans can "make up for lost time", so to speak. If your first planting gets flooded, or if it's too wet to get any crop in, you can wait until it's dry and…

Many years ago one of my neighbours tried not rotating is crops. It worked out okay the first couple of years, but it wasn't long before his yields nosedived and within the five years he was bankrupt.

Re: The fertilizer shortage will persist in 2023

#120

Post by danuker »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #93
danuker wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is my thinking dangerous? Not allowing profit is dangerous, because it won't attract suppliers. High prices might prompt some people elsewhere to reduce their consumption, in favor of ones more in need. You can address some of the future price uncertainties with a futures market. That way, you can see what the price you'll get in 7 months' time, and decide what you should plant. But if a place has no means of gro…

> High prices might prompt some people elsewhere to reduce their consumption By dying. There is a famine in madagascar right now.v > in favor of ones more in need. Do you need 1 kg of bacon more than a poor family in madagascar needs 10kg of wheat that was used to feed your bacon? > How is my thinking dangerous? Because men than need to feed their children might grab torches and pitchforks Free market does not store…

In Romania, there is a wave of people installing their own electricity production in response to the higher prices.

This will reduce electricity demand, and therefore prices, including for other countries.

This is an example of government getting out of the way (and deciding against the former oligopoly of energy suppliers).

https://www.energynomics.ro/en/anre-the-number-of-prosumers-...

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