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The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

davidrozado.substack.com

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Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#371

Post by mshake2 »

jonathanlb wrote: post #353
edgyquant wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again, replace “men” with “African Americans” and you also have a statistically true statement (in America at least) that would be considered taboo.

That is a falsehood. Per the FBI: "White individuals were arrested more often for violent crimes than individuals of any other race and accounted for 59.1 percent of those arrests." https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2019/crime-in-the-u.s.-...

Whites are 60% of the population though, so they're being arrested in proportion with their representation. They also do not separate white-latino and white-non-latino, so the colloquial "white" is being lumped in with another ethnicity. Also, in 2019, blacks were just under 13% of the population, yet they are represented 2x-4x over in virtually ever crime category in that table.

So it is true and you're distorting the table.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#372

Post by mellosouls »

SpeedilyDamage wrote: post #199
mellosouls wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you read the article you will see examples of imbalanced moderation that conservatives have pointed out for ages with unfortunate dismissals (like yours? am I reading you correctly?) in response. This article is useful as it places them in a relatively neutral investigative context. It is obviously right that racist, sexist, etc bias is pointed out, but that case is not at all helped by complacency in response to…

[flagged]

That's my point; it's not clear there's any political bias taking place here.

What are you talking about?? Reread the article:

OpenAI content moderation system is more permissive of hateful comments being made about conservatives than the same comments being made about liberals.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#373

Post by int_19h »

AussieWog93 wrote: post #296
freedomben wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, I think some of the most damaging policies in existence are the draconian drug laws. There is clearly much bipartisan support for them, but Conservatives in general are much more deeply held on it. Many believe drug use (except their own) is immoral and that justifies the heavy paternalistic approach they take. There are definitely "morally superior" people on both sides of the coin, they just tend to have di…

For real? Drug use (including alcohol) is probably the most common way for people to seriously and irreperably destroy their lives. A "paternalistic approach" is absolutely justified if it can prevent this level of harm.

Putting people in prison for drug use is also a very common way to seriously and irreparably destroy their lives, including cases where their drug use was not, by itself, harming them.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#374

Post by slg »

int_19h wrote: post #335
slg wrote: post #57

Isn’t this likely from bias in the training data? The system is more sensitive to label something as hate if that group is more likely to experience hate on the internet. How the system responds to “Blacks” vs “African-Americans” is a perfect example of this. The latter has historically been perceived as more respectful so it won’t be used as often in the hate speech in the training data. I bet using “the blacks” wou…

Of course it is a bias in the training data, but it's probably not the dataset that you're thinking of. So far as we can tell, the filtering part doesn't come from the main corpus, but rather from human-guided moderation - basically, people voting on whether any given answer is "hateful" or not. ChatGPT filters reflect the biases of that later group (or, perhaps, the biases of the people who instructed them).

But that is the same problem. There aren't any human reviewing the requests as they come in. That human guided moderation gets converted into some type of model that isn't any smarter than ChatGPT. That model is just as susceptible to this issue.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#375

Post by gisely »

s0sa wrote: post #350
gisely wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes it an opinion? If I were to say that the Nazi party in Germany peddled in hatred and demonization of already-marginalized groups would you say that is an opinion? Just because a statement pertains to political groups doesn't make it a mere opinion.

Nazi Germany, really? Equating AI bias against the groups pointed out in the article to theoretical AI bias against Nazi Germany is a political opinion, yes.

Hmm? No equating happening in my comment. The point was that just because statement is about a political group doesn't mean it's a only an opinion. Mentioning Nazi Germany is just using an extreme example to make clear that statements about political groups aren't inherently mere opinions.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#376

Post by zwkrt »

Flatcircle wrote: post #366

I heard a friend who had a brilliant theory. The rise of ad profiling from Facebook and Google etc, has bleed into the public consciousness at large and now it's considered normal to categorize people by race, gender, politics, and income etc. First the companies did, and now we all do. But of course, a person is more than their race, or gender, or income, etc. Most of the time they have very little in common with th…

Maybe I am just brilliant but this has been obvious to me the whole time. Advertisement and the 'need' to market to groups results in reifying those groups in the population. The more the marketing works, the more the groups actually become differentiated, and it creates a positive feedback loop.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#377

Post by fnfontana »

prometheus76 wrote: post #110
fnfontana wrote: post #74

I have perceived that since the first days. I've even debated with ChatGPT about it lol. I can foresee many AIs propagating biases and people believing without critical reasoning, like it was an oracle. Actually it's already happening. The AI may be biased because most of the literature and other materials used for training is biased towards left leaning ideologies. The AI should be neutral and unbiased.

Your last sentence is impossible. Even in choosing which "facts" to regurgitate and which to withhold, the AI will introduce bias, and there are infinite facts.

I understand it.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#378

Post by isleyaardvark »

legolas2412 wrote: post #369
jonathanlb wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a falsehood. Per the FBI: "White individuals were arrested more often for violent crimes than individuals of any other race and accounted for 59.1 percent of those arrests." https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2019/crime-in-the-u.s.-...

Why would you not normalize by population to quote per Capita numbers?

Because the original comment said “most” and not “more”.

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#379

Post by [deleted] »

Jensson wrote: post #345
mxkopy wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This 'men are violent, therefore women must also be bad in some way' rhetoric makes no sense. There's no purpose for it other than assuaging sore feelings.

Women are bad at higher level math in the same way men are violent. Not all are, but its a trend. However you aren't allowed to say that for one group, but you are allowed for the other. So this has nothing to do about statistical accuracy, its just political pressure from one side.

[deleted]

Re: The unequal treatment of demographic groups by ChatGPT/OpenAI content moderation

#380

Post by fnfontana »

prometheus76 wrote: post #110
fnfontana wrote: post #74

I have perceived that since the first days. I've even debated with ChatGPT about it lol. I can foresee many AIs propagating biases and people believing without critical reasoning, like it was an oracle. Actually it's already happening. The AI may be biased because most of the literature and other materials used for training is biased towards left leaning ideologies. The AI should be neutral and unbiased.

Your last sentence is impossible. Even in choosing which "facts" to regurgitate and which to withhold, the AI will introduce bias, and there are infinite facts.

That's why I've said should, not must. There's no cosmic exile and all the knowledge that we have is yet limited.
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