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Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

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Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#581

Post by ausbah »

mantas wrote: post #521
ausbah wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why does it fall on the person being made uncomfortable to correct the behavior of the being making them uncomfortable?

Who else would? If something makes you uncomfortable and you don't try to correct that... It will keep going. Of course, sometimes that's not possible (threat of physical violence and whatnot), but in many cases it is perfectly fine. Especially if the other person is just naively making you uncomfortable instead of trying to harm you. And being corrected on the spot is much more effective than someone else telling yo…

I mean there's a certain amount of social awareness of what to do & what not do due in different contexts I don't think is wrong to assume someone has (barring cultural differences, neurodiverse conditions, the occasional misreading of social cues), asking someone out out of the blue is one of those things

yeah it's not a cardinal sin or explicitly hurting someone, but I would expect a well adjusted 21-23 year old male engineering senior to know this

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#582

Post by caskstrength »

xupybd wrote: post #277
boppo1 wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rule 1. Be attractive. Rule 2. Don't be unattractive. It's not a joke.

While this is true, you have a lot more control over this than you may realize. Especially if you're a male seeking a female. Most men think they same physical characteristics they're interested in will be appealing to the opposite sex. There are many physical traits that women prefer but they're less shallow than us men. Confidence and the ability to talk are huge. You're social status among your peer group. How wel…

> There are many physical traits that women prefer but they're less shallow than us men.

> Confidence and the ability to talk are huge. You're social status among your peer group. How well you dress. Do you look after yourself physically. All of these things can be developed.

So, "fit smooth-talking alpha guy"? I'm not sure I agree with it, but your description seems _very_ shallow TBH.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#583

Post by throway33 »

IncRnd wrote: post #525
throway33 wrote: post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The parent comment used the word mate. Yes, but not in the context of calling their "prospective cuddlybear" a mate.

It was the exact same context, a commenter on HN lamenting the difficulty for 80% of men to meet a women, unless one is aggressive, made as a comment in an article about a group of older-year, leching males. You are interpreting that to mean "find a life partner".

Yes, I am.

> Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#584

Post by jimbokun »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #345
jimbokun wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This just isn’t true at all. Women have different personalities and indicate their attraction or lack of attraction in very different ways. Flirting for some women is the exact same behavior presented to everyone for other women. If you want to know if a woman is attracted to you, ask her out and see what she says

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34590521 how does one ask a woman out if the default is supposed to be "don't hit on me right now ever"?

Because that is just one person posting a comment on Hacker News. It doesn't reflect reality.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#585

Post by 8f2ab37a-ed6c »

beaned wrote: post #125
wilsonnb3 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody cares if college students try to date other students from their classes. It is weird when people take a class specifically because of that reason though. It is even weirder when the class in question is something that they have a very high skill level in specifically so that they will be able leverage that into some kind of situation that leads to dating. This is pretty cut and dry to me, I am not sure why so…

> It is weird when people take a class specifically because of that reason though. The ends seem to justify the means, sometimes. I know a married couple who met on a college campus. While students, the man (boy at the time, really) was a manager and chose his and her hours at the campus store so they would overlap. They tell this story proudly. The distinction between weird and romance seems to be whether it succeed…

Bingo. Also aware of at least a few married couples who met in class at my uni.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#586

Post by lelanthran »

zozbot234 wrote: post #532
lelanthran wrote: post #530

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm only assuming that these guys would also want to attract or favorably impress these [sensible] women somehow; if so, what they are doing is not really helpful or conducive to that goal. That's a very big IF . Their goal seems to be to attract an (or more) attractive woman(women). There is no indication that your assumption is in any way correct, and I've no idea why one would assume this. Your post came off as…

The point is not that they should be "getting the correct girls" but "getting the correct attitude and behavior from these same girls" - behavior that helps you romantically, that is. Let's go through this step by step. If you're just barely getting a girl to agree to a date, you're basically back at square one in terms of wooing her - except that now you've also foolishly thrown away a chance to be friendly with her…

> "getting the correct attitude and behavior from these same girls" - behavior that helps you romantically, that is.

They appear to be doing just fine with the girls, which once again makes me question why you think that the girls who welcome these advances are behaving incorrectly.

Everything else you say is purely wishful thinking on your part and there is literally no evidence that the males are not getting whatever it is they are aiming to get.

The complaints, remember, are not coming from those girls who date, it's coming from the professor (who is unhappy about this), and from the girls who aren't getting advances.

The TLDR is this: There's no obvious evidence for any of your conjecture about how courtship should go; in this case it obviously is going correctly if the girls who get advances aren't complaining, but the ones who don't are complaining.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#587

Post by User23 »

jimbokun wrote: post #308
User23 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Women signal interest or a lack thereof in a thousand ways. Picking up on that is a basic social skill and like all skills some persons are more capable than others.

This just isn’t true at all. Women have different personalities and indicate their attraction or lack of attraction in very different ways. Flirting for some women is the exact same behavior presented to everyone for other women. If you want to know if a woman is attracted to you, ask her out and see what she says

> If you want to know if a woman is attracted to you, ask her out and see what she says

Sometimes she'll say no to test to see if you're serious or not and probably to test your social acumen too. Picking up whether it's a "no, I'm not interested" or a "no, but I want to see more" is exactly the kind of social cue reading I'm talking about.

And yeah learning that can be rough for people who aren't naturals and especially rough for spectrumy folks. Some of whom will probably even say there is no such thing at all because they can't see it. But them's the breaks. The reality of the sexual marketplace is what it is.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#588

Post by bradlys »

GlenTheMachine wrote: post #569
bradlys wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well if she’s fending off men - why would they be friendly? I’m not friendly to anyone who acts like an asshole to me. Your daughter is also probably just not attracted to the overwhelming majority of those men. She’s probably quite picky. Very common with engineering women since they have endless options.

How would you feel about being in an environment where 75% of the people are mad at you because you didn’t want to get naked with them? Would you find that environment conducive to professional development?

Talk about a strawman.

At no point are the men getting mad at her or expressing that. They're not like, "Well fuck you, ya damn stupid cunty bitch." They're not doing that and you know they're not. If she just says no thank you then all they do is walk away feeling down. If instead she's super aggressive and an asshole about it like: "ew no, you fucking incel dweeb. Fucking die!" then maybe they have all the reason to be mad at her.

Doubt your daughter is going to be telling you when she acts like the later though.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#589

Post by xupybd »

caskstrength wrote: post #582
xupybd wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While this is true, you have a lot more control over this than you may realize. Especially if you're a male seeking a female. Most men think they same physical characteristics they're interested in will be appealing to the opposite sex. There are many physical traits that women prefer but they're less shallow than us men. Confidence and the ability to talk are huge. You're social status among your peer group. How wel…

> There are many physical traits that women prefer but they're less shallow than us men. > Confidence and the ability to talk are huge. You're social status among your peer group. How well you dress. Do you look after yourself physically. All of these things can be developed. So, "fit smooth-talking alpha guy"? I'm not sure I agree with it, but your description seems _very_ shallow TBH.

I'm not sure I understand where you're coming from.

What traits, that are found attractive, would you describe as less shallow?

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#590

Post by GlenTheMachine »

bradlys wrote: post #588
GlenTheMachine wrote: post #569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would you feel about being in an environment where 75% of the people are mad at you because you didn’t want to get naked with them? Would you find that environment conducive to professional development?

Talk about a strawman. At no point are the men getting mad at her or expressing that. They're not like, "Well fuck you, ya damn stupid cunty bitch." They're not doing that and you know they're not. If she just says no thank you then all they do is walk away feeling down. If instead she's super aggressive and an asshole about it like: "ew no, you fucking incel dweeb. Fucking die!" then maybe they have all the reason t…

And how the hell would you know that, exactly?

The most basic way misogyny gets expressed is through the wholesale disregard of what women tell you if it doesn’t match your preconceived ideas.

I have chosen to believe my daughter (and, fwiw, my wife). You can say what you want, but this is what I am being told by two of the people I love and respect most in the world: it is exhausting and demoralizing to have to consistently wonder whether someone is being nice to you because they like you or because they want to sleep with you.

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