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Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

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Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#81
post #17
post #8

Don't let senior level students audit junior level classes? Why are they even there besides the reasons outlined in the problem? This is a problem with the University because they don't want to acknowledge a problem. Do they really think that's going to last? If it was my daughter who left the class because she was harassed I'd be very angry.

Why do people see this as even remotely unethical? It seems to me that it's great that plenty of younger people are getting essentially free tutoring sessions and fun friendships/relationships out of it. Unless there's sexual assault/battery being alleged here, this is both ethical and good for all the students involved!

Maybe it would help to imagine it's an all men's school and it's young men who feel uncomfortable being hit on while they need to learn. I'm not saying it's any different, I'm just saying shifting it this way be help you think about how it's a power imbalance.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#82
It's so weird to see people defend this because this seems like fairly textbook power harassment. If this was to occur at work where some managers were organizing their pods or such so that they're the only man in a group of women for the sake of dating it would clearly be seen as a problem.

If the story is true, people auditing courses should be treated with a higher level of responsibility. Giving preferential treatment as a result because you want to date them or find them attractive isn't the purpose of auditing at all. This isn't to say it's wrong to potentially date someone while auditing a course, but the intention behind joining in the first place is what matters.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

eh, there's really no good signal for women to display that says "hey, i'm open to being hit on right now" or "please don't hit on me right now"

THE DEFAULT IS "please don't hit on me right now"

What can be accepted as “it’s okay to hit on me right now”? I don’t disagree with your assertion btw. Determining collective social etiquette can be challenging, and I’m always interested in other perspectives to better understand other humans in general.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#84
post #43

> This might be hard, as no unwanted advances are taking place. We simply have students excelling at the course, and drawing-in a crowd. I should've been more clear with my "leching" comment. Still, it seems harassing in nature. It seems increasingly that society demands a world where dating only happens during designated and approved dating times and venues, and outside those strictly delimited places, men are to be…

Birth rates are tanking because of increased access to contraceptives and people having the wealth and freedom to enjoy their 20s and 30s unburdened by children

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#85
post #43

> This might be hard, as no unwanted advances are taking place. We simply have students excelling at the course, and drawing-in a crowd. I should've been more clear with my "leching" comment. Still, it seems harassing in nature. It seems increasingly that society demands a world where dating only happens during designated and approved dating times and venues, and outside those strictly delimited places, men are to be…

Nobody cares if college students try to date other students from their classes. It is weird when people take a class specifically because of that reason though. It is even weirder when the class in question is something that they have a very high skill level in specifically so that they will be able leverage that into some kind of situation that leads to dating. This is pretty cut and dry to me, I am not sure why so…

"Weird" is not the same as "immoral"

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#86
post #15

People can tsk tsk this, but it's damn hard to find a mate if you are not in the top 20% of (straight) men, and basically requires you to be aggressive like this. You may be praised for being a "nice guy" by being passive, but it will not get you dates.

As a woman, I can speak on experience that women will run away from any space men try to invade to seek us, whether it's dating apps, classes, bars, etc. The last thing I want is for a horde of thirsty men to chase me.

Which is why the general advice to men "adopt a hobby" to meet a girl generally doesn't work. It's transparent and therefore defeats its purpose.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#87
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Women aren't dumb. They almost certainly already know what the deal is, and I doubt they'd be phased by it if they were attracted to a guy.

I lament to say it but I tend to agree. "Sunlight is the best disinfectant" was my first reaction, and I felt awful & loss hearing your comment (because I simultaenously also agree!), but I'm also back to some transparency in the end, if less hopeful (that this would turn out/cleans us of what feel like thin actions). It's up to people to decide, hopefully from an informed place! Simply posting about this & hopefully…

> "Sunlight is the best disinfectant"

A showboat youtube channel?

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#88

I suspect that if you just announced this fact to the women in the class - either officially, if that doesn't get you in trouble, or under the table if it would - then the problem would basically solve itself. Certainly no males in the class would be getting dates.

Women aren't dumb. They almost certainly already know what the deal is, and I doubt they'd be phased by it if they were attracted to a guy.

“If a sexy man compliments me it’s fine. If an ugly man looks at me too long it’s harassment”

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#89

I suspect that if you just announced this fact to the women in the class - either officially, if that doesn't get you in trouble, or under the table if it would - then the problem would basically solve itself. Certainly no males in the class would be getting dates.

Why would you think that? Young women aren't oblivious to their own charms. They know what they're doing. They're getting free 1-on-1 tuition from a nerd, and the nerd gets to be within 3 feet of an attractive young woman - maybe even more than that, let's not be naive about college campuses - which might otherwise be impossible. Everybody wins. You might even upset the women most of all! When the quiet part is said…

Because I have an attractive daughter studying engineering, and she tells me that her single biggest problem is that she constantly has to reject, avoid, or otherwise fend off male advances nearly every day. It's exhausting, it makes her never feel at ease in her classes, and she is constantly being distracted when what she really wants is quiet time to figure out integration by parts or whatever.

As a male, this is not a problem I ever had, but I believe her. She isn't making it up.

Re: Need help with students who've turned my class into a dating service

#90

I still have clear recollection of the 50:1 men-to-women ratio in my CS2xx classes and higher. Your odds weren't good if you were hoping to meet Mrs. Right. I imagine things have gotten better since. Still, seems like a fairly high effort low outcome place to meet someone who is likely not even receptive to advances in that context. Do colleges not offer many other opportunities for people to meet outside of class in…

Things have not gotten better. I had several 3 and 4 hundred level CS classes with literally zero women in them. This was at a large, major public school with several hundred in our CS program.

But if it's not a pipeline issue, what could it be!
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