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Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

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Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#501

Post by hezralig »

I studied Econ in college because it was a particular interest of mine. I hated it. I also wanted to understand it, so that I could know why it rubbed me the wrong way and live intentionally to push against it.

There was this moment when I was in a grad course and the professor was talking about self-optimizing markets. That's when it hit me. I literally stood up in the class, interrupted everything and went like "wait, the math isn't optimizing for income inequality". It was kind of funny watching more than 100 little economists in training suddenly start tearing apart the equation at once. You could literally hear the sound of frantic spreadsheeting and charting.

In the end, the professor himself said that it was true, you could achieve a fully "optimized" economy with literally everything being owned by a handful of people. Made me think.

How is a system supposed to be beneficial for us all when the mathematics at its core don't actually consider societal benefit?

If an economy is fully "optimized" but everyone is sick, sad, and angry - is it actually optimal?

A mathematical model can make sense without being sensible. This is why I have an implicit distrust of algorithms and other systems of optimization.

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#502

Post by moistly »

keiferski wrote: post #134
kelseyfrog wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I have something to learn, but what load-bearing social foundation would public pajama-wearing endanger?

Respect for other people, general social norms, polite behavior, personal dignity, and in general just a respect for one's appearance and a desire to make "civilization" aesthetically appealing. People seem to enjoy living in beautiful buildings with green parks nearby, without pollution or noise, and yet somehow think dressing like a slob or putting zero effort into one's appearance is unimportant. To be honest, if…

A trip to “Citizens of Walmart” (or whatever it’s called) provides a much more solid argument for dress standards. Pyjamas are pretty crass, but they don’t hold a candle to the vulgar, bizarre, and even pornographic stuff that you’ll see on that website.

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#503

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

operatingthetan wrote: post #405
vladimirralev wrote: post #95

The economy is just increasingly fake or rewarding foolish scummy behaviour instead of honest cooperative work. People coasted for 10+ years now on "passive income" from printed money along with almost no enforcement action against scams. That gave rise to a chain reaction of people trying to scam each other in a general revenge. Take for example a big slice of the economy - real estate. Honest real estate agents who…

>Honest real estate agents who try to match real needs to real properties were totally displaced (or outcompeted) by agents who spam fake ads in order to secure an exclusive contract with unfair terms and sell you the biggest property you can afford with no regard of your actual needs. The Fed in turn backstops any losses and buys toxic mortgages perpetuating the scheme. There's lot's to criticize about real eastate…

It's only disproportionate for buyer's agents in a buyer's market or seller's agents in a seller's market when the cost of a crap shack is $800k+ - which unfortunately is a growing part of the country.

If you're unaware - the brokerages can take up to 40% of the agent's commission. That's where the real rip off is.

There's lots of places where the median home is still 70% of 3% of $250k = $5250

Typically, R/E agents are 1099 - which means they're paying ~10% more income tax in the employer's side of Medicare and Social Security.

That's $4446 after payroll tax but BEFORE income tax.

You're lucky if you're selling >1 house a month.

Just because real estate agents aren't writing code and aren't making doo-dads, doesn't mean they're doing nothing, or that their time is worthless.

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#504

Post by phs318u »

ignoramous wrote: post #245
somethoughts wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just personal but anytime I feel similar to the OP, I watch something by Hans Rosling [1] or Anna Rosling [2]. Although 10 and 5 years old respectively, I feel the general sentiment is still true - that human progress is slow, in the background and might be ebbing and flowing in your specific sub-population. And when compared to the present, media narrative driven present its hard to see the improvements happ…

Reminds me of this tweet by Derek Thompson (writer at The Atlantic ): In 2022, we: - Reversed organ death in pigs - Made the first embryo from stem cells - Made a pan-influenza vaccine - Saw the beginning of time - Got best-ever results from cancer & obesity therapy trials - Maybe cracked the case of multiple sclerosis From: https://twitter.com/DKThomp/status/1600864770751860737 ( https://archive.is/pi95L )

Yes. It’s a shame that more people than ever can’t afford the medical insurance to appreciate these advances.

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#505

Post by [deleted] »

MikeBattaglia wrote: post #424
noud wrote: post #7

I think you're way off base. It's called rosy retrospection, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosy_retrospection . As you already mentioned in your comments, you're judging the past disproportionately more positive that the present. If you really want to know if everything is declining, try measure it everyday for the next five years. For example, every day, rate your personal well being, track how (un)happy you are wit…

There are some pretty clear indications that the derivative of civilization is strongly negative at the moment, particularly if you live in Europe. Actually, the fact that people are supposed to pretend things are OK, while everyone over there is possibly a few steps away from being drafted into war, is another sign that things have headed in the wrong direction in exactly the manner OP is suggesting.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#506

Post by Dudeman112 »

laidoffamazon wrote: post #406
tejohnso wrote: post #117

> Anyone else have other examples? Elected president who is so crass and generally offensive he wouldn't have gotten close to being elected 50 years ago. Elected president who is showing clear signs of age related cognitive decline (so they say) but continues to occupy the office. Elected presidents with criminal behaviour that is far worse than what previous presidents were impeached or resigned for. Mental illness,…

> Elected president who is showing clear signs of age related cognitive decline (so they say) but continues to occupy the office. Donald Trump is many things, but I really don't think he's seeing more cognitive decline than an average 76 year old.

I'm reasonably sure that one doesn't refer to Trump

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#507

Post by CJefferson »

keiferski wrote: post #191
uneekname wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I try not to argue with strangers much on the internet, but I really disagree with you on this one. What someone wears is a part of their self-expression. In this post, you use the phrases "respect for one's appearance" and "care about [one's] appearance" to suggest that people have a responsibility to follow certain norms in how they dress in order to make "'civilization' aesthetically appealing," in your words. Aes…

Some people think that aesthetics is entirely subjective. This is the default view of Western liberal democracies, especially among people that haven’t really thought much about the topic. Some people, including a lot of philosophers and art theorists that can be considered “experts”, disagree. I would consider myself in this camp, although not a credentialed expert by any means. And no, I’m not “projecting my aesthe…

You've made a massive leap here. Of course there is an argument that aesthetics aren't entirely subjective.

Are there any noteworthy philosopher who says (in effect, obviously not this exactly) people shouldn't go around in pyjamas?

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#508

Post by HEmanZ »

yieldcrv wrote: post #236
maerF0x0 wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah the stock trading in congress is another one for your list. I sometimes feel like America is the most corrupt country I've ever encountered. it's not overt like "Pay me $50 and you can avoid a ticket" but it's pernicious and wide spread. - Law makers trade on what they're going to vote prior to voting it - charging people a different price for the exact same procedure, at the same location, under the same market…

everything on this thread relies on ignorance about what was occurring in some prior time so transparency is improving huh

Thank. You. I’m shocked by how little historical context people here have.

It almost makes me wonder if the average age on here is extremely young? I remember at a young age I felt like the world was falling apart because I had 0 historical context, but a little bit of learning goes a long way to seeing how much the world has improved. Even in recent years.

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#509

Post by next_xibalba »

Meta commentary:

Does anyone else notice that the comments which appear to agree with OP seem to be lacking both data and historical and contemporary world knowledge?

Pure speculation: OP and supporters are living through their first economic cycle inflection as working adults.

Re: Ask HN: Why Is Everything Declining?

#510

Post by mach1ne »

solarmist wrote: post #474
mach1ne wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to sound adversarial, but you’re not presenting any evidence either. Where do you get that innovation is the fastest it’s ever been?

You’re not wrong, but THAT is the item you want evidence on? Especially here. This seems disingenuous.

Innovation in narrow fields is not representive of the greater whole. Sure, generative AI is booming, but mobile phones and computers haven’t evolved practically at all in the last 5 years. The general rate of innovation can be somewhat gauged in the increase of living standards, and to my understanding there has been little the past 10 years (in the West in general).
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