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Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

smithsonianmag.com

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Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#31

Post by Aardwolf »

ddejohn wrote: post #27
Ralfp wrote: post #26

My favorite archeologic discovery when it comes to ancient central Europe is the Tollense Valley Battle. Around 3300 years ago in central Europe two groups, estimated 4000 men total, have clashed on and around a 120 meters long stone bridge crossing the river and valley of Tollense. By the time those men engaged, this bridge was some 500 years old already, which means it was build 3800 years ago. This battle tells us…

What a fascinating read. Thanks for sharing. I can't help but think of Motel of the Mysteries whenever reading about archaeology.

"archeologists discovered a porcelain chair on which one can sit like a throne, with a hole in the center and an elaborate mechanism for flushing water, used for ritual purposes"

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#32

Post by pavlov »

ddejohn wrote: post #27
Ralfp wrote: post #26

My favorite archeologic discovery when it comes to ancient central Europe is the Tollense Valley Battle. Around 3300 years ago in central Europe two groups, estimated 4000 men total, have clashed on and around a 120 meters long stone bridge crossing the river and valley of Tollense. By the time those men engaged, this bridge was some 500 years old already, which means it was build 3800 years ago. This battle tells us…

What a fascinating read. Thanks for sharing. I can't help but think of Motel of the Mysteries whenever reading about archaeology.

“The Dawn of Everything” by David Graeber and David Wengrow is a recent book that really opened my eyes to how much the usual interpretation of prehistory is subject to myths of inevitable progress from small egalitarian organizations to kings and cities. The societies of past were probably much richer in form and more consciously designed that we have assumed.

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#33

Post by LarryMullins »

zetazzed wrote: post #2

Ancient Celtic culture was really into the practice of casting valuable objects into bodies of water - apparently this was a central religious practice for them. So what did the Romans do when they conquered Celtic territory?They would auction off the rights to dredge a captured lake and keep its treasure, Storage Wars style. Truly a pioneering capitalist civilization!

I wonder if the Arthurian legend of Excalibur being thrown back to the Lady of the Lake as an offering is some distant echo of that (far older) Celtic tradition.

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#34

Post by pelasaco »

Aardwolf wrote: post #31
ddejohn wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a fascinating read. Thanks for sharing. I can't help but think of Motel of the Mysteries whenever reading about archaeology.

"archeologists discovered a porcelain chair on which one can sit like a throne, with a hole in the center and an elaborate mechanism for flushing water, used for ritual purposes"

the daily ritual, probably

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#35

Post by tinus_hn »

lostlogin wrote: post #25
zetazzed wrote: post #2

Ancient Celtic culture was really into the practice of casting valuable objects into bodies of water - apparently this was a central religious practice for them. So what did the Romans do when they conquered Celtic territory?They would auction off the rights to dredge a captured lake and keep its treasure, Storage Wars style. Truly a pioneering capitalist civilization!

It might all be chance, but Ive visited a few Roman religious sites that appear to be built on top of earlier sacred sites and it makes me think that the Romans just slapped their temples down on top of other religious places and carried on with the rituals.

Unless you kill all the locals chances are they also would like to carry on with their rituals. So a strategy is to mix your own religion with the local rituals and thus absorb the population into your own culture.

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#36

Post by timeon »

tinus_hn wrote: post #35
lostlogin wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might all be chance, but Ive visited a few Roman religious sites that appear to be built on top of earlier sacred sites and it makes me think that the Romans just slapped their temples down on top of other religious places and carried on with the rituals.

Unless you kill all the locals chances are they also would like to carry on with their rituals. So a strategy is to mix your own religion with the local rituals and thus absorb the population into your own culture.

Most famous example is Christmas. From winter solstice to black friday.

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#37

Post by mseepgood »

ftyers wrote: post #18

I always wonder what they mean by "ritual", it always seems to be a throwaway word for modern or ancient cultures that just have different beliefs or traditions. But it's rarely used when talking about the author's (or anthropologist's) own culture.

It just means "we have no idea what they were thinking".

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#38

Post by yellowapple »

hvs wrote: post #8
colechristensen wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read SPQR The Romans are really… familiar. They invented the blueprint for western civilization and there are lots of things about the people that feel very modern. With a few tweaks and lucky chances, the Industrial Revolution could have happened more than 1000 years earlier. To get a sense of this go look up translations of Roman graffiti, especially at Pompeii.

The idea that the Roman Empire was on the verge of an Industrial Revolution on par with the 19th and 20th centuries is a bit overblow: https://acoup.blog/2022/08/26/collections-why-no-roman-indus...

Not sure I buy the article's explanation. It seems to hinge on the Industrial Revolution being dependent on coal, which was dependent on a use case for coal, which was powering Spinning Jennies at scale... but it was always my understanding that the invention of the Spinning Jenny was "the" start of the Industrial Revolution, and in any case the article just punts the question: what stopped the Romans from inventing the Spinning Jenny or something comparable? Surely the Roman textile market would've warranted it, no?

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#39

Post by yellowapple »

pyuser583 wrote: post #23
colechristensen wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read SPQR The Romans are really… familiar. They invented the blueprint for western civilization and there are lots of things about the people that feel very modern. With a few tweaks and lucky chances, the Industrial Revolution could have happened more than 1000 years earlier. To get a sense of this go look up translations of Roman graffiti, especially at Pompeii.

The Roman attitude toward work was the exact opposite of the capitalist attitude. Romans saw work as servile and debasing. One reason they had slaves was so they could be insulated from it. It’s hard to see that attitude leading to the Industrial Revolution.

Capitalists also see work as servile and debasing. The reason they have employees is so they can be insulated from it.

It's easy to see that attitude leading to the Industrial Revolution.

Re: Archaeologists Unearth 3k-Year-Old Wishing Well in Germany

#40

Post by yellowapple »

ftyers wrote: post #18

I always wonder what they mean by "ritual", it always seems to be a throwaway word for modern or ancient cultures that just have different beliefs or traditions. But it's rarely used when talking about the author's (or anthropologist's) own culture.

The archaeological/anthropological sense of "ritual" is more about a behavior being performed consistently and commonly than it is about attempting to describe an belief system underlying behavior (or even if one exists at all).

My culture has quite a few rituals; I'm indeed engaging in one (eating a meal and some drinks in a communal space at a long table) right now :)

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