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Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

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Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#411

Post by richbell »

Spivak wrote: post #385
richbell wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or they didn't add filters for misandry because they were only concerned about misogyny. This is a classic pattern. For example, people have complained numerous times about Google's search suggestions and results for certain topics, e.g. "my boyfriend hits me" yielding sponsored information about domestic violence but "my girlfriend hits me" not yielding anything.

Sure, and the solution isn’t “wow google is so biased the solution is to show no results for anyone in the name of fairness.” Go contact OpenAI about how you’re concerned that their bot can produce misandry and try to convince them it’s an important issue that should higher in their backlog.

> Sure, and the solution isn’t “wow google is so biased the solution is to show no results for anyone in the name of fairness.”

I'm not saying it is; indeed, I recognize that fairness is often about equity and not equality.

However, it's naive to assume that certain things don't exist because their authors simply didn't have the time or resources necessary. In many cases what's available is a direct result of their biases.

To further my previous example, I have met people who are vehemently against resources for men's around mental health or domestic violence because they believe that men are inherently privileged and thus undeserving. As another commenter mentioned somewhere in this thread, what gets added or removed is a direct reflection of the author's biases and endorsement of a specific worldview.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#412

Post by dragonwriter »

7speter wrote: post #113
MuffinFlavored wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is it about our current American society that leads to basically a 50-50 split in registered voters? Why aren't (R)s able to see and respect (and convert) to values of (D) (or vice versa?) Why are people so stuck in their ways? Why does it feel the conversion rate for convincing people to "change their values" or "see things differently" is basically 0? Do we have any stats on whether we really are in one of the…

Well, for starters, liberals and conservatives concentrate themselves into geographical areas, and beyond that there are regions that attract a given kind of politics (landlocked vs coastal regions). When theres such a concentration of people who think alike, people can just think its a no brainer as to why a majority would be on their side. Not to mention the divided, heavily opinionated, clickbait driven news media…

> Well, for starters, liberals and conservatives concentrate themselves into geographical areas

Not as much as popular media pretends, the illusion of this is true is mostly an artifact of the electoral system.

> and beyond that there are regions that attract a given kind of politics (landlocked vs coastal regions).

Again, not really, though there is a bit of a second order effect; the divide is more urban/rural, and, again, is exaggerated in popular perception largely because of FPTP voting and other political structutres which artificially magnify even slight local dominance (e.g., local governments with vote N of M with N winners super-FPTP bodies, which give local aligned bare pluralities 100% control of a multiseat body, aren’t unheard of.)

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#413

Post by mikem170 »

mistermann wrote: post #48
chomp wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not specifically a conservative issue. I can get chatgpt to write about reduction in scope of the federal government, strong state powers, the benefit of lowered taxes and regulations for business, and elimination of central banks. It happily writes about them. There's only one group of people who are upset, and it's about one group of topics. Note that I cannot get chatgpt to write about why Donald Trump is ter…

> It's not specifically a conservative issue. I can get chatgpt to write about reduction in scope of the federal government, strong state powers, the benefit of lowered taxes and regulations for business, and elimination of central banks. It happily writes about them. For now, anyways, and only to a degree - I've had some sessions with ChatGPT where it is more than happy to explain why certain actions (those of non-U…

> I think it would be prudent for some group of people to write a set of unit tests asking various questions to these AI models so we can detect when strategic changes are being made to their behavior.

That's a great idea. Various AI models could be rated for objectivity. Only downside is that AI designers might try to game the tests.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#414

Post by Spivak »

nyolfen wrote: post #384
Spivak wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alternatively, if the sum of all human writing is racist I would absolutely prefer it be reweighted so it’s not. The last thing we need is for AI models like this to be an amplifier for the very worst of human nature.

great, what happens when the eye of sauron turns on something you don't feel is justified? what recourse do you have?

I'll be mad when that happens. Which is how everything in the world works. The thing you seem to actually be afraid of is power not what people are doing with it. We literally have a system for compelling the behavior of private companies, public pressure and legislation. If the "Eye of Sauron" decides to turn on minorities or women they'll run afoul of Title IX and laws establishing federally protected classes.

Is there something currently unprotected you think the eye is poised to gaze upon? Like I get the "first they came for the fascists, the racists, the misogynists, and the homophobes" argument but the resolution is more likely to be "and then the world was better off" not "and then they suddenly turned their focus to family values."

There's always gonna be nuance on the edges and I think we would agree that in that case it's better to err on not taking action but trying to pretend that everything is grey and there aren't very clear things sitting in darkness does a disservice to people's ability to recognize and do something about obvious harm.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#415

Post by freejazz »

nhchris wrote: post #397
crote wrote: post #395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are two problems with this. The first is that facts are useless without context. For example, the answer to "Were Jewish people overrepresented in finance during the middle ages in Europe" is "yes" - it is a well-researched historical fact. However, that misses the context that the majority Christian population was forbidden by their religion to lend money, essentially making the Jewish population the only peop…

The questions weren't about the middle ages. They explicitly specified the US finance industry. Furthermore, it was perfectly willing to provide "facts without context" for other groups.

So? We also don't live in the middle ages and the reality of our lives today is that many people believe in these antisemitic tropes which spread in these fashions.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#416

Post by nyolfen »

Spivak wrote: post #414
nyolfen wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

great, what happens when the eye of sauron turns on something you don't feel is justified? what recourse do you have?

I'll be mad when that happens. Which is how everything in the world works. The thing you seem to actually be afraid of is power not what people are doing with it. We literally have a system for compelling the behavior of private companies, public pressure and legislation. If the "Eye of Sauron" decides to turn on minorities or women they'll run afoul of Title IX and laws establishing federally protected classes. Is t…

title ix is not a protection for "women and minorities", but i know that some racism and sexism is the good kind :)

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#417

Post by DontchaKnowit »

freejazz wrote: post #415
nhchris wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The questions weren't about the middle ages. They explicitly specified the US finance industry. Furthermore, it was perfectly willing to provide "facts without context" for other groups.

So? We also don't live in the middle ages and the reality of our lives today is that many people believe in these antisemitic tropes which spread in these fashions.

You're doing the same bullshit chatgpt was doing. Its fine to say white people are overrepresented but for some reason its am antisemetic trope to say Jews are overrepresented in finance. Both statements are factual. No ones being antisemetic or anti white. Just stating facts.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#418

Post by akiselev »

wizeman wrote: post #373
braingenious wrote: post #344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Postscript: (Still not interacting with wizeman) This poster that has just only learned of the word “woke” according to them but also wants to educate folks about it has a lot to say in other threads! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34415794 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34418890 The only reason why I’m revisiting this is to point out that they have (as I’ve pointed out) gone through with the natural pivo…

> This poster that has just only learned of the word “woke” according to them I only just learned about how the term is used as an insult in your language. Again, I'm not from your country, so we don't necessarily use it the same way here (as an imported word), capiche? But apart from the word itself, we do have definitely imported the same ideology here, as well as the crazies who take it to an extreme. I'm not sayi…

The best way to prove braingenious wrong is by not engaging with him [1]. This is a pseudoanonymous internet forum - not responding and moving on with your life is a perfectly acceptable response to this situation [1]!

If you’re not a far right troll, you gain nothing by trying to prove it [1].

[1] IF you’re not a far right troll

Edit: FWIW I don’t believe you when you say “your language,” hence the [1]. “Capisce” is too specific a colloquialism to American English.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#419

Post by DontchaKnowit »

nhchris wrote: post #375
boppo1 wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any discussion about Jews in finance not held by Jews themselves is a hair away from devolving into an antisemitic /pol/ discussion about 'white genocide'. Any professional who touches the subject with even a ten foot pole immediately gains a nefarious following whether they want it or not. Having such a following of internet nazis is a liability for any professional reputation on a number of axes. Edit: I'm curious…

> Having such a following of internet nazis is a liability for any professional reputation on a number of axes. Which is quite bizarre, when you think about it. In a country as systemically racist and white-supremacist as the US*, one would think such a following would be a boon , not a liability. *According to consensus among experts specialized in this field

News flash - everyone in the US hates nazis and bigots except nazis and bigots. These people live in their own echo chambers and are totally divorced from the rest of society because they are social pariahs. The more they are pushed to the fringe the more extreme their rhetoric becomes because they feel invalidated and resentful.

You talking about how bizarre this is a brilliant irony. The truth is America is not systemically racist and is not white supremecist, and damn sure not in comparison with the rest of the world. Youre surprise here is due to the error of your prior assumptions, not because the fact is even remotely surprising.

Re: Conservatives think ChatGPT has gone 'woke'

#420

Post by DontchaKnowit »

smrtinsert wrote: post #338
phpisthebest wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other example I found more alarming was the discrepancy when asked to write about Joe Biden Corruption, vs Trump Corruption. Trump it was free to write about, but was blocked from even writing a fictional story where Joe Biden was corrupt. That should be very alarming to everyone

That's an overreach for sure, but in this case I'm sure the issue 100% of the Trump sell is that it's actually Biden is corrupt. This is why projection and "accusing your enemy what you are guilty of" is so effective, it creates distrust in systems, societal or technological

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