Love subsidizing public infrastructure directly as well as paying taxes!
As this gets more popular, I guess net metering will be offered less and less. But you should still get some credit for supplying electricity to the grid.
EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
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Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#12How did BritishVolt go bankrupt then?
Manufacturing battery cells is very energy intensive, so I’m guessing that the recent sky-high UK energy prices spooked their investors and made UK battery manufacturing look unviable.
Something like NorthVolt, on the other hand, works because they have access to reliable low-cost hydro in Northern Sweden.
Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#13I assumed this meant selling EoL EV batteries back to providers who convert them into grid storage. An EoL EV battery still has a decade or more of life as a grid-scale battery.
It includes both. But since EV manufacturing capacity is ramping up so fast, the amount of battery capacity in cars is going to be a lot larger than the amount in EoL car batteries for a while.
Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#14Love subsidizing public infrastructure directly as well as paying taxes!
This is the future, like it or not. There’s a lot of energy tied up in batteries, or at least their can be. And until we solve the problem of harnessing intermittent energy sources for when they aren’t generating energy, we aren’t going zero emissions.
Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#15I think EV owners would need to find some level of compensation for the additional cycles they would incur. Electric vehicles are expensive because of the battery so deteriorating the life of one of the most costly parts of the car doesn't feel like a great solution.
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Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#16Love subsidizing public infrastructure directly as well as paying taxes!
As this gets more popular, I guess net metering will be offered less and less. But you should still get some credit for supplying electricity to the grid.
On the contrary, I would expect to be paid higher rates for the energy I'm supplying to the grid than those I paid to charge it in the first place. Otherwise, what's the point? I'm not going to buy a kilowatt-hour high, then sell it low.
Only way these grid balancing schemes work is if the pricing is real-time, and I have an opportunity to supply marginal peak demand at rates that are higher than what I paid to charge (while still being lower than what peaker plants would cost)
Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#17Love subsidizing public infrastructure directly as well as paying taxes!
It's possible for market forces to drive batteries out of consumer reach, and then you'll own the car and rent the battery. Is that better?
Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#18I think EV owners would need to find some level of compensation for the additional cycles they would incur. Electric vehicles are expensive because of the battery so deteriorating the life of one of the most costly parts of the car doesn't feel like a great solution.
I agree. This further degrades the meaning of owning private property.
Unless it's voluntary (which it darned well better be).
I envision a future where individual appliances (including EVs) can opt in to spot pricing for the electricity they consume (or produce). That would naturally incentivize charging during off-peak hours and discharging during peak hours, all without requiring any government incentives or coercion. It could also be useful for other major appliances which could benefit from the lower prices afforded by load shifting, such as hot water heaters.
Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#19I think EV owners would need to find some level of compensation for the additional cycles they would incur. Electric vehicles are expensive because of the battery so deteriorating the life of one of the most costly parts of the car doesn't feel like a great solution.
Did you know that the standard DC chargers communicate with the vehicle using PLC (Powerline communication) chips even though that communication is not over the high power conductors? I've always had the feeling the grid operators got that included because they thought they were going to communicate directly with the battery management system to control it as they wish. It never happened and now the standard is stupidly complex and they're still trying to use cars as storage without much consideration for what vehicle owners want.
Sure, offer variable rates. Offer interruptabke service. But stop wanting V2G, nobody actually wants it.
Re: EV batteries alone could satisfy short-term grid storage demand as early as 2030
#20I think EV owners would need to find some level of compensation for the additional cycles they would incur. Electric vehicles are expensive because of the battery so deteriorating the life of one of the most costly parts of the car doesn't feel like a great solution.
Selling electricity is compensation, like with solar panels. You only need hourly energy prices to make it profitable. Plus an app that does the profitability calculation and discharging.