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The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

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Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#91

Post by cinntaile »

pclmulqdq wrote: post #77
cinntaile wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is similar to the plastic straws at all. The focus for banning gas stoves is on the (respiratory) health issues associated with gas cooking of the household. It is not about climate change.

So says the climate change institute who funded the study. The real reason seems to be elsewhere: people care about cooking with gas, but they use gas heaters if they have gas. If you can stop people from cooking with gas, you can switch entire houses to electric more quickly.

Somebody else mentioned the same argument but I'm not buying it. Gas use for heating has a much bigger impact on your personal finance than just a gas stove, but you're saying gas stove cookers have an almost religious devotion to using gas because it's so much better? The problem is... If it's almost religious then rational arguments won't reach them anyway.

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#92

Post by ceejayoz »

treeman79 wrote: post #65
hermannj314 wrote: post #62

Who is pushing to ban gas stoves? First it was adding catalytic converters in cars, then regulating tobacco, banning asbestos, removing contaminants from drinking water. It never stops. This is nothing more than one more rung in a decades long campaign of using the democratic process to hold companies accountable for pollutants and slowly improve the health and well-being of millions of Americans. Sure, air is cleane…

The president is pushing this

No; one of five CPSC commissioners gave an interview in which he indicated they're thinking about potentially doing something about the impact of gas stoves on interior air quality, in which he noted (generally) that the CPSC has the authority to ban products that can't be "made safe".

There's zero indication gas stoves can't be "made safe".

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#93

Post by ceejayoz »

bob1029 wrote: post #49

The respiratory argument I really don't understand with specific regard to gas vs electric cooking. I don't care if my range is powered by alien technology that magically sequesters carbon somewhere else - When you heat something above a certain temperature, you are producing all kinds of chemical compounds that are not going to be good for you. It doesn't really matter how the mass was brought to that temperature. T…

> If the primary concern is everyone's health & safety, we should mandate high CFM extraction hoods be installed above every range and run public information campaigns to encourage their use.

That may well be the sort of mitigation the CPSC goes with. (And probably just in new construction.)

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#94

Post by peteradio »

hermannj314 wrote: post #62

Who is pushing to ban gas stoves? First it was adding catalytic converters in cars, then regulating tobacco, banning asbestos, removing contaminants from drinking water. It never stops. This is nothing more than one more rung in a decades long campaign of using the democratic process to hold companies accountable for pollutants and slowly improve the health and well-being of millions of Americans. Sure, air is cleane…

Natural gas is the most common energy source for winter heat in America, do you believe that should be banned?

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#95

Post by stephen_g »

ccalloway wrote: post #19
mikrl wrote: post #7

It’s politicized too which is ridiculous. I’ve seen takes that being pro gas cookery is right-wing. Yes, it’s obvious that gas heat and cooking could cause respiratory issues due to combustion. As a gourmand though, cooking on a gas range is the best experience wrt temp control and convenience. I prefer an electric oven, and the heating system I’m impartial to, though radiant hot water is what I fondly remember from…

The thing about burning gas for heat in your home is that it's either very clean, or there is something seriously wrong with your system. There is no scope for it causing 'respiratory issues' except in a setup so broken that it's not legal (or shouldn't be legal) to operate. Unlike for example a wood stove which might release some smoke into your house, at a level where it's not good for you, but not violently toxic.

In some countries unflued has heaters are common, which do cause indoor air quality issues. Furnaces that vent the exhaust just cause air quality issues outside, not inside.

But the article is about gas stoves, which do release significant NOx output into the house, which domestic rangehoods are generally not very effective in removing quickly enough.

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#96

Post by MDWolinski »

hospadar wrote: post #31

Induction maaaan! Switched from gas to induction and love it. I miss my stove every time i have to cook elsewhere. Mine is pretty much the cheapest induction range on the market (and i bought it used). Heats up way faster than gas (WAY FASTER, will get cast iron glowing if i leave an empty cast iron on the stove for a while at the highest setting), low/medium control is excellent and precise, and i really appreciate…

To use copper pans (or any non-induction pan) is to use a transfer plate, which allows the induction to work and heats up in a traditional electric way.

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#97

Post by bryanlarsen »

peteradio wrote: post #94
hermannj314 wrote: post #62

Who is pushing to ban gas stoves? First it was adding catalytic converters in cars, then regulating tobacco, banning asbestos, removing contaminants from drinking water. It never stops. This is nothing more than one more rung in a decades long campaign of using the democratic process to hold companies accountable for pollutants and slowly improve the health and well-being of millions of Americans. Sure, air is cleane…

Natural gas is the most common energy source for winter heat in America, do you believe that should be banned?

Berekely, SF and NYC have banned gas hookups in new developments, and yes, I agree with that.

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#98

Post by rsynnott »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #88
rsynnott wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gas stoves aren't a significant _environmental_ problem, certainly in terms of CO2 (in fact, unless your electricity is almost entirely renewable or nuclear, they're probably marginally better than electric from a CO2 perspective). There is a concern that they're a health risk, though (though the evidence that there's a large effect is somewhat weak). Personally, I like my gas stove, though I expect to have to adapt…

A CCGT is about 60% efficient, and an induction stove is about 3x as efficient as a gas stove. So cooking directly with gas uses over 50% more gas than cooking on an induction top using electricity generated from gas.

> A CCGT is about 60% efficient

Depends exactly where you live, but it's unlikely that all the gas generation is by CCGT; a lot of places would use far less efficient plants for peaking at least.

> and an induction stove is about 3x as efficient as a gas stove

Hmm, where are you getting this? From a quick look, gas stoves are about 40-50% efficient, induction about 85%.

You also have to consider transmission loss, and the possible (in many places likely) presence of coal in the electricity supply.

In any case this is all pretty irrelevant; stoves just aren't a big enough piece of peoples' energy consumption.

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#99

Post by hermannj314 »

peteradio wrote: post #94
hermannj314 wrote: post #62

Who is pushing to ban gas stoves? First it was adding catalytic converters in cars, then regulating tobacco, banning asbestos, removing contaminants from drinking water. It never stops. This is nothing more than one more rung in a decades long campaign of using the democratic process to hold companies accountable for pollutants and slowly improve the health and well-being of millions of Americans. Sure, air is cleane…

Natural gas is the most common energy source for winter heat in America, do you believe that should be banned?

If we were talking in 1923, you would have told me coal was the most common.

The world is allowed to change with new data and new technology.

Not exactly certain of the history, but embracing natural gas after WW2 and through the 1950s was an easy choice for most Americans.

I imagine, someday, the world will change again.

Re: The gas industry is paying Instagram influencers to gush over gas stoves (2020)

#100

Post by _djo_ »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #30

No shit they're paying for some marketing. IDK who was expecting otherwise. They're not stupid. They're not so apathetic they're just gonna roll over and take it. Sure most of the manufacturers are also in the electric stove business but they've got huge capital investments in manufacturing they don't want to lose so when the executive announces out of the blue they're considering a ban of course they open the market…

Marketing is one thing, astroturfing is another. Companies are free to do it, of course, but others are also free to call it out as the deceptive practice it is.
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