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House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

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Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#81

Post by pandaman »

wwweston wrote: post #47
wustangdan wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a hard time combining this sentiment with my lived experience in California.

If California were particularly terrible, it wouldn't be so damn popular, and most of its problems would go away. California does have some specific policy problems, but most of what it has are popular place problems. It also doesn't pass muster with my own lived experience. I've loved all of the 15 years I've spent in both Northern and Southern metro California, and I'd do it again.

How do you gauge popularity of a state? I am guessing not by the net domestic migration [1], which would seem to be a natural choice in this case.

1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ...

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#82

Post by dragonwriter »

wustangdan wrote: post #28
mrguyorama wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Republicans have run on a platform of "Government is terrible at it's job" for 50 years, and every time they get elected they work really hard to prove it.

I have a hard time combining this sentiment with my lived experience in California.

> > Republicans have run on a platform of "Government is terrible at it's job" for 50 years, and every time they get elected they work really hard to prove it.

> I have a hard time combining this sentiment with my lived experience in California.

I have no problem at all reconciling it with my 45 years of lived experience in California. About the only good thing California Republicans did for government in that time is provide such a flagrant display of how a minority dedicated to scoring political points with no concern for the general warfare could abuse supermajority requirements as to motivate California voters to change the Constitution to make the state somewhat practically governable despite the existence of the California Republican Party by removing the legislative supermajority requirement for the annual budget.

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#83

Post by ashwagary »

taylodl wrote: post #72
gremlinsinc wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People complain of Californians moving here as well, driving up costs but nobody looks at the 385 vacant AirBNB's in a town of 45k (Cedar City, UT). If you had 385 homes open up for student or family housing the rental crisis would plummet and prices would drop to normal. If they go un-filled that means they need homeowners instead of renters and will be back on the market at lesser prices because demand will drop if…

So you're saying the government should regulate how you use your private property? That's an interesting idea coming from a so-called "red" state.

Hotels should be zoned for commercial activity. He's right about the AirBNB business model increasing homelessness.

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#84

Post by ashwagary »

slowmovintarget wrote: post #61
bb88 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Republicans have mostly lost their ideological way it seems like. They seem to just be against anything the Democrats are for these days. The J6 response from the Republicans is the hallmark about power and politics in the party these days. Law and Order is fine long as it's only applied Biden's son or Hillary Clinton.

> They seem to just be against anything the Democrats are for these days. This. This was the problem with Democrats for a long time. They weren't for anything, they were just against Republicans. Republicans in government used to be well-educated and their main ideological thrust was based on a set of principles of limited government, free-market capitalism, and maximum agency of the governed. They fell short of this…

This political posturing will probably ensure an increase in support come election time.

People are getting savaged by inflation while the Democrats want the IRS to hire more agents that have a habit of targeting the middle income and poor because they are low hanging fruit.

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#85

Post by ashwagary »

_null_ wrote: post #57
optimalsolver wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>They know it won't become law Didn't Brexit start as a "there's no way this will actually happen" signaling gesture by establishment Conservatives?

There is literally no way a Democrat controlled Senate even reads this bill. To your point though, a good example of that kind of thing is the idiocy of Republican states who passed years of anti-abortion "trigger laws" in case Roe/Casey were ever overturned. They all assumed those precedence would never be overturned, and so they could be as extreme as they wanted. Now they are reckoning with their posturing.

Will voters barely making ends meet dealing with inflation prefer the party that doesnt send government agents to attack them while they are struggling?

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#86

Post by mixmastamyk »

bb88 wrote: post #80
wwweston wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This sparked a housing crisis here in Boise, Idaho. How interesting. Presumably as enlightened examples of the opposite of California governance, they wouldn't have any such thing as a housing crisis caused by popularity. Or... it could be they've had the luxury of not having popular-place problems thus far, and like everyone else are suddenly discovering that actual governance is hard.

They came here to escape California governance, I guess, but in the end just made life worse for everyone else living here. My property taxes have more than doubled over the last decade.

NIMBYs are everywhere while the population is always growing. Did you think you would escape it, or just want to blame city slickers who like a roof over their head?

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#87

Post by wwweston »

dragonwriter wrote: post #82
wustangdan wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a hard time combining this sentiment with my lived experience in California.

> > Republicans have run on a platform of "Government is terrible at it's job" for 50 years, and every time they get elected they work really hard to prove it. > I have a hard time combining this sentiment with my lived experience in California. I have no problem at all reconciling it with my 45 years of lived experience in California. About the only good thing California Republicans did for government in that time i…

Amen. And don't forget that some of the formative policies people are critical of now (cough Prop 13) actually stem from periods where conservatives had the pull to win elections and ballot initiatives in California.

And California's progressive lock arguably isn't even really old enough to drive.

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#88

Post by keewee7 »

trilbyglens wrote: post #40
wwweston wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is astoundingly well-functioning and most US citizens astoundingly lucky by historical and/or global standards, and certain kinds of minimally functional mutual accountability are part of the reason why we've gotten this far. There's also plenty of room for improvement of course (including learning from other industrial social democracies as well as recent internal issues), so that's relative, but the most rea…

Astoundingly well functioning maybe if you ignore literally every single other developed nation on the planet.

You're probably correct if you don't consider Southern Europe and Eastern Germany to be developed.

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#89

Post by bb88 »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #86
bb88 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They came here to escape California governance, I guess, but in the end just made life worse for everyone else living here. My property taxes have more than doubled over the last decade.

NIMBYs are everywhere while the population is always growing. Did you think you would escape it, or just want to blame city slickers who like a roof over their head?

If you're defending NIMBYism with this post, it fails on many fronts.

Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax

#90

Post by jleyank »

hardtke wrote: post #77
bb88 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So 23% consumption tax? Or would you be talking higher? I'm not sure 23% would be enough to offset the loss of the federal income tax.

23% is what is in the bill as the initial starting rate.

If that’s across the board and there’s no relief for lower income or retirees it’s going to suck hard. My income tax rate is lower than that…. And I asked about state/local taxes as removing state revenue from source a will replace it with source b. Remove existing taxes, and the national vat will sit on top of state or provincial vats as in Canada and I assume elsewhere.
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