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House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
51–60 of 102 posts
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#52This is just the first in a long list of "messaging" bills that will come from a very slim Republican House, because there is Democratic control of the Senate. They know it won't become law. The point is to rile up the media, get hits on cable news, fund raise, and generally be useless as a governing body. This is what both parties do when they are out of power, and I would say is what they _prefer_ to do. It's easie…
I really don't get this “both parties” attitude. There is no basis for that argument. There is a lot to criticize about Democrats, but they at least want to govern.
The "Green New Deal" was 100% a messaging bill, never intended to pass, and was admitted to be as such by those that drafted it. Just one example.
*I'd argue that most people in either party do _want_ to govern. But each one is being hijacked by loud minorities who would rather perform.
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm sorry I'm not following you. Are you saying that what the US has now is well-functioning social institutions with mutual accountability? Since they oppose this by trying to pull funding from them.
The US is astoundingly well-functioning and most US citizens astoundingly lucky by historical and/or global standards, and certain kinds of minimally functional mutual accountability are part of the reason why we've gotten this far. There's also plenty of room for improvement of course (including learning from other industrial social democracies as well as recent internal issues), so that's relative, but the most rea…
The US government is the bloodiest, most indebted, and most imprisoning institution on the planet.
And I agree, it is astoundingly well-functioning at it.
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have a hard time combining this sentiment with my lived experience in California.
If California were particularly terrible, it wouldn't be so damn popular, and most of its problems would go away. California does have some specific policy problems, but most of what it has are popular place problems. It also doesn't pass muster with my own lived experience. I've loved all of the 15 years I've spent in both Northern and Southern metro California, and I'd do it again.
California is popular because of its _climate_ and despite all of the batshit insane policies that have been legislated.
I'm gradually approaching retirement age and looking for a place with better climate to retire to, but everywhere I've visited - including California - has a lot of negatives that outweigh the positives of where I currently live, which (by a lot of metrics) has some of the worst climate in the nation. Despite all of that, I might still put up with additional crap elsewhere to live in a more moderate climate. Don't underestimate climate as a powerful decider for where people live.
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Would this eliminate the federal income tax leaving state and lower taxes? The proposal “gets rid of the national personal and corporate income taxes and abolishes the IRS…as well as implements a national sales tax. Additionally, the bill gets rid of the death, gift, and payroll taxes.”
The rate seems to be 23%, and given that this is only a sales tax this would mean the federal government is taxing at maybe 10-15% of GDP. If I remember correctly, federal government expenditures are around 30% of GDP.
So 23% consumption tax? Or would you be talking higher?
I'm not sure 23% would be enough to offset the loss of the federal income tax.
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#56For better and worse, this is pretty much what I'd expect. It's not a serious attempt to genuinely govern or otherwise make reasonable policy, it's sending up an ideological flag, and since the fundamental ideology is actually opposed to the idea of well-functioning social institutions with mutual accountability...
> since the fundamental ideology is actually opposed to the idea of well-functioning social institutions with mutual accountability A charitable interpretation of Republican "fundamental ideology", as it were, would be that they prefer more well-functioning social institutions at lower levels of government, closer to the people those institutions are meant to serve. It would make sense than beyond just a publicity st…
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Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#57This is just the first in a long list of "messaging" bills that will come from a very slim Republican House, because there is Democratic control of the Senate. They know it won't become law. The point is to rile up the media, get hits on cable news, fund raise, and generally be useless as a governing body. This is what both parties do when they are out of power, and I would say is what they _prefer_ to do. It's easie…
>They know it won't become law Didn't Brexit start as a "there's no way this will actually happen" signaling gesture by establishment Conservatives?
There is literally no way a Democrat controlled Senate even reads this bill.
To your point though, a good example of that kind of thing is the idiocy of Republican states who passed years of anti-abortion "trigger laws" in case Roe/Casey were ever overturned. They all assumed those precedence would never be overturned, and so they could be as extreme as they wanted.
Now they are reckoning with their posturing.
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
> since the fundamental ideology is actually opposed to the idea of well-functioning social institutions with mutual accountability A charitable interpretation of Republican "fundamental ideology", as it were, would be that they prefer more well-functioning social institutions at lower levels of government, closer to the people those institutions are meant to serve. It would make sense than beyond just a publicity st…
There was a point where I would have held the charitable reading of Republican ideology and I still know some people who identify with the party who probably understand their own position this way. But at this point, no, I don't believe that's actually what's animating it. Selective election denialism is as nihilistic about local institutions as it is about national ones, while theories about state legislatures overr…
Republicans have mostly lost their ideological way it seems like. They seem to just be against anything the Democrats are for these days.
The J6 response from the Republicans is the hallmark about power and politics in the party these days. Law and Order is fine long as it's only applied Biden's son or Hillary Clinton.
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#59For better and worse, this is pretty much what I'd expect. It's not a serious attempt to genuinely govern or otherwise make reasonable policy, it's sending up an ideological flag, and since the fundamental ideology is actually opposed to the idea of well-functioning social institutions with mutual accountability...
> since the fundamental ideology is actually opposed to the idea of well-functioning social institutions with mutual accountability A charitable interpretation of Republican "fundamental ideology", as it were, would be that they prefer more well-functioning social institutions at lower levels of government, closer to the people those institutions are meant to serve. It would make sense than beyond just a publicity st…
A charitable interpretation of Republican "fundamental ideology", as it were, would be that they prefer more well-functioning social institutions at lower levels of government, closer to the people those institutions are meant to serve.
But that's not what this does. This doesn't do anything to transition power away from the federal government. It just makes it impossible for the federal government to do its job.
That doesn't prove that they're not interested in the well-being of the country, but only because they know this won't succeed. If they thought it could pass, it would be wildly irresponsible. Instead, all we know is that at this moment they've chosen to make a grand and pointless gesture instead of actually governing.
Re: House Republicans to vote on bill abolishing IRS, eliminating income tax
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
If California were particularly terrible, it wouldn't be so damn popular, and most of its problems would go away. California does have some specific policy problems, but most of what it has are popular place problems. It also doesn't pass muster with my own lived experience. I've loved all of the 15 years I've spent in both Northern and Southern metro California, and I'd do it again.
Thousands of Californians left this last year or two and moved to Idaho. This sparked a housing crisis here in Boise, Idaho. I would assume these are left and right of center folks looking for cheaper housing and a better life. At one point last year the median household income was $75k/year. The median house price was $525k or so. Basically this created the situation if you couldn't afford a house before the housing…
> This sparked a housing crisis here in Boise, Idaho.
How interesting. Presumably as enlightened examples of the opposite of California governance, they wouldn't have any such thing as a housing crisis caused by popularity.
Or... it could be they've had the luxury of not having popular-place problems thus far, and like everyone else are suddenly discovering that actual governance is hard.