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Common Lisp: 2022 in review

lisp-journey.gitlab.io

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Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#51

Post by lairv »

smcn wrote: post #39
lairv wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious, are you able to write full backend services in CL, with http and database interactions, or "just" some domain logic ? If it's the former I'm curious what kind of libraries you are using

Yes, absolutely. For context, we do stock market analysis but we approach it from the perspective of stock prices being entirely supply and demand, and we're looking for stocks which are about to receive a lot of new demand. We handle A LOT of data. Well, a lot for what we do, we're not exabyte scale yet. We use Postmodern for Postgres interaction. Have no complaints at all. You're able to use s-sql which is SQL stat…

I only started learning CL during last month advent of code, and it's incredible to know you can do so much with the language, thanks for the insights. As other have mentioned, you can count me in if you ever write a blog about the process

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#52

Post by crapaud23 »

dgan wrote: post #43
rchtwlm wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I have no particular feelings for or against the JVM. It always surprises me when people get so passionate about runtimes - how much do you interact with them? They're just in the background doing their thing. I can see reasons for not wanting to use the JVM in specific cases. For example, it may not have the performance you want for the application you're developing. I'm just confounded by general statements su…

Why => because JVM is poor no fit for CLI, and is a poor fit for games. Those two fields in which I see myself using common-lisp. Unsure what's so wierd about it, everyone (most) knows about slow cold startup times, and inability to control memory layout in JVM. Also, horrible C bindings

For me it's microcontrollers, however I've heard in spite of the unmaintained status, clojure-scheme[1] is very usable. It uses gambit to produce C-code you can compile anywhere.

https://github.com/takeoutweight/clojure-scheme

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#53

Post by medo-bear »

tmtvl wrote: post #38

ACL2 gets mentioned in passing, but it may be worth noting that version 8.5 was released this year, with several new features and bug fixes: https://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/moore/acl2/v8-5/combined-man...

Maxima should also deserve a mention I think

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#54

Post by smcl »

dgan wrote: post #44
smcl wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

May I ask why? I've no dog in this fight (I don't work with Java) but I've seen plenty of people against Java the language who were very happy to use Scala or Clojure. I haven't encountered anyone who has specifically said they were against the JVM , so I'm interested whether it's something technical (maybe you do more real-time or work with resource-constrained systems) or if it's something more personal. There are…

Copy pasted: Why => because JVM is poor no fit for CLI, and is a poor fit for games. Those two fields in which I see myself using common-lisp. Unsure what's so wierd about it, everyone (most) knows about slow cold startup times, and inability to control memory layout in JVM. Also, horrible C bindings

I didn't say it was weird :(

Just was curious if it was one of the commonly encountered things (which you listed) or if there were some other limitations I wasn't aware of.

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#55

Post by yoyohello13 »

dgan wrote: post #43
rchtwlm wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I have no particular feelings for or against the JVM. It always surprises me when people get so passionate about runtimes - how much do you interact with them? They're just in the background doing their thing. I can see reasons for not wanting to use the JVM in specific cases. For example, it may not have the performance you want for the application you're developing. I'm just confounded by general statements su…

Why => because JVM is poor no fit for CLI, and is a poor fit for games. Those two fields in which I see myself using common-lisp. Unsure what's so wierd about it, everyone (most) knows about slow cold startup times, and inability to control memory layout in JVM. Also, horrible C bindings

I'm with you on stock JVM. The slow startup time is often a deal breaker for me. But there are projects that address this. Like https://github.com/babashka/babashka for Clojure. Or GraalVM for general JVM use.

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#56

Post by richard_todd »

dgan wrote: post #43
rchtwlm wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I have no particular feelings for or against the JVM. It always surprises me when people get so passionate about runtimes - how much do you interact with them? They're just in the background doing their thing. I can see reasons for not wanting to use the JVM in specific cases. For example, it may not have the performance you want for the application you're developing. I'm just confounded by general statements su…

Why => because JVM is poor no fit for CLI, and is a poor fit for games. Those two fields in which I see myself using common-lisp. Unsure what's so wierd about it, everyone (most) knows about slow cold startup times, and inability to control memory layout in JVM. Also, horrible C bindings

How do you control memory layout in Common Lisp?

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#57

Post by iainctduncan »

dgan wrote: post #43
rchtwlm wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I have no particular feelings for or against the JVM. It always surprises me when people get so passionate about runtimes - how much do you interact with them? They're just in the background doing their thing. I can see reasons for not wanting to use the JVM in specific cases. For example, it may not have the performance you want for the application you're developing. I'm just confounded by general statements su…

Why => because JVM is poor no fit for CLI, and is a poor fit for games. Those two fields in which I see myself using common-lisp. Unsure what's so wierd about it, everyone (most) knows about slow cold startup times, and inability to control memory layout in JVM. Also, horrible C bindings

you might be interested in embedded Schemes. I use s7, which shares a lot of features with both CL and Clojure (for a Scheme) and is very easy to embed in C or C++ apps. I use it for music coding, but others (e.g. Naughty Dog) have done it for games. It's a super fun way to develop. My high level code is mostly Scheme, interfacing with low level C.

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#59

Post by mark_l_watson »

This will take a while to read through! I have been using Common Lisp since 1982, love the language, but I have been drifting over to Python more in the last 8 years because of support for deep learning.

That said, I think CL is the best research language.

Re: Common Lisp: 2022 in review

#60

Post by vindarel »

tmtvl wrote: post #38

ACL2 gets mentioned in passing, but it may be worth noting that version 8.5 was released this year, with several new features and bug fixes: https://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/moore/acl2/v8-5/combined-man...

excellent point, thanks. It's added. I mostly prepared the post with the reddit history, that means someone missed the opportunity to inform the broader Lisp community there.

For Maxima, what could be added?

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