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Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

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Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#51

Post by stevecooperorg »

Homunculiheaded wrote: post #44
stevecooperorg wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you: what we think of as 'pro' programming -- writing large programs in formal languages and running it past an interpreter/compiler -- is probably only something the few will really get into. However, there's a couple of exceptions to this idea I'm not sure how to handle. MS EXCEL : It's a programming experience, of a sort, and is incredibly popular. I think it uses similar skills to writing code, but i…

I actually think the excel example demonstrates that we are unlikely to see that many more programmers in the future. As much as people use excel in their offices there is still the idea of the 'excel wizard' who really understands the functions and features of excel. It's actually quite surprising how many people I've encountered who use excel pretty frequently and still don't know many of it's basic features. The f…

I think there's a pyramid of automation. Something like

    1. Set an alarm on a phone
    ...
    4. Basic Excel formulae
    5. Excel Wizard
    ...
    7. JavaScript copy-paste coder
    ...
    10. Professional programmer
The original post suggested that there are more and more incentives for people to push themselves up the ladder. I don't think it'll necessarily mean a whole segment of people people jump from 2 to 10; rather, I think peopel trying to get an edge in the job market could shift up a bit, taking the distribution higher. So Excel users will become Excel wizards, word processor users become HTML coders, etc

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#52

Post by gmartres »

moocow01 wrote: post #8

I think the shortage of software development skills really has to do with the lack of there being enough people who get impassioned with this kind of stuff. When I step out of my bubble I realize that its really difficult to find cultural-personality fits for what building software requires. Most people are just not like 'us' for better or worse. Most people don't get giddy over implementing a new algorithm or buildi…

Here is an exercise... flip the table and think if our industry was going away and you needed to find a job in a completely new industry/job role.

Mathematician, without hesitation.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#53

Post by jbester »

BrokerChange wrote: post #12

Farming became obsolete because of economies of scale. Factory work became obsolete because of economies of scale. Manufacturing became obsolete because of economies of scale. What do you think is our generation's economy of scale? I think the near future will involve making it possible for anyone, even those without a technical background, to quickly build beautiful internet products. What do you think is the next b…

Obsolete is a strong word. What happens in these industries is that they get split into the high-end (organic farming, small order manufacturing) and the mass-production low-end. Yes in many ways margin have fallen but overall production has gone up, way up.

That being said - retail seems to be our generation's victim. In the last decade, we've replaced media consumables with digital equivalents. This alone has mostly killed music, book, and movie rental stores. It's not just retail stores but retail services - tax prep, insurance, and financial services. Some of this took place in the 90's, but it continued in the 00's and it will continue in the 10's.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#54

Post by stevecooperorg »

rythie wrote: post #49
Homunculiheaded wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually think the excel example demonstrates that we are unlikely to see that many more programmers in the future. As much as people use excel in their offices there is still the idea of the 'excel wizard' who really understands the functions and features of excel. It's actually quite surprising how many people I've encountered who use excel pretty frequently and still don't know many of it's basic features. The f…

I remember in 90s you were called a computer wizard if you how to type a document and print it. Expectations change.

Very true. Anyone who could confidently boot up a computer had a that geek cache/tarnish.

Is there an example of expectations changing around programming or automation, specifically? Programming, as opposed to computer literacy.

I suppose what I'm wondering is, why is there such a barrier to programming? People are more and more comfortable with complex apps, but not really more liable to fire up some kind of text editor... It's quite a jump to make on your own, I think -- say, going from Excel formulae to VBA macros, or using a WYSIWYG HTML editor to coding JavaScript.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#55

Post by stevecooperorg »

benvanderbeek wrote: post #48
Nitramp wrote: post #23

Citation missing, but I've read a paper that claimed rather convincingly that you need a certain mindset both to be good at programming and to enjoy programming (unsurprisingly, this comes hand in hand). It's not really problem solving, it's rather a specific kind of structured thinking. It's the attention to detail and the will to think through every aspect of an issue, to find a complete solution. That's also a use…

I was talking to a (print) design friend the other day who's trying to learn to code. It's interesting to explain to a non-programmer what kind of person will/can become a programmer. If you don't love solving problems by digging and automating, then you will never be a programmer. As you say, not because of intelligence but rather desire and enjoyment.

Did your friend have any incentive to try it for themselves? For example, automating Photoshop using ActionScript? Maybe pro programmers like solving general problems, but professionals in other fields would be interested in solving things in just their domain.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#56

Post by InclinedPlane »

"Coding" isn't one thing. We wouldn't imagine that it makes sense to put a home "cook" whose idea of making a pie encompasses placing a can of premade pie filling into a premade pie shell in the same bucket as a chef with several Michelin stars under their belt. Coding has as much range and as many different roles as cooking does, if not more, but there doesn't exist a well defined set of labels enumerating such divisions of skill and specialization.

Certainly "coding" will increasingly become prevalent in more and more professions. But that says little about whether the coding equivalent of "chefs" will be more numerous or not.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#57

Post by noduerme »

Nitramp wrote: post #23

Citation missing, but I've read a paper that claimed rather convincingly that you need a certain mindset both to be good at programming and to enjoy programming (unsurprisingly, this comes hand in hand). It's not really problem solving, it's rather a specific kind of structured thinking. It's the attention to detail and the will to think through every aspect of an issue, to find a complete solution. That's also a use…

The analogy here to law is spot on. My dad and two brothers were lawyers; I grew up in an environment where getting pancakes for breakfast on Sunday required parsing statements made days earlier and finding contradictions between them and the statements being made now. Learning to think that way, however, is not just another skill in an infinite toolbox of possible skills, all of which are equal and each of which you can be proud of in a touchy-feely way. Learning to think, and talk, and conceive in advance what you'll do next that way is akin to learning the art of war. The adaptation to programming is pretty minor. Programming is mickey mouse lawyering. The beauty of law is that someone's actually right; there's a logic at work, and teasing out the convoluted threads is your job. I can dig it. If I liked people more, I'd do it. But to say it's a preference or a happenstance aptitude, rather than a learned, honed, bludgeoned and beaten-in skill, is to seriously underestimate the people who are good at it.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#58

Post by noduerme »

kenjackson wrote: post #20
moocow01 wrote: post #8

I think the shortage of software development skills really has to do with the lack of there being enough people who get impassioned with this kind of stuff. When I step out of my bubble I realize that its really difficult to find cultural-personality fits for what building software requires. Most people are just not like 'us' for better or worse. Most people don't get giddy over implementing a new algorithm or buildi…

I think the shortage of software development skills really has to do with the lack of there being enough people who get impassioned with this kind of stuff. I was at a party recently I was asking someone about their work. I was really interested in how they solved certain problems, etc... We were probably only talking a minute or so when she says, "Can we not talk about my job and ask me about my car or some great me…

No work, no tech and no food? God help you if you ask her about politics or religion. She was hot, obviously. Sounds like a nightmare.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#59

Post by the-cakeboss »

FuzzyDunlop wrote: post #42
kenjackson wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the shortage of software development skills really has to do with the lack of there being enough people who get impassioned with this kind of stuff. I was at a party recently I was asking someone about their work. I was really interested in how they solved certain problems, etc... We were probably only talking a minute or so when she says, "Can we not talk about my job and ask me about my car or some great me…

I think you can look at this another way too. How many people in other industries voluntarily embark on pet projects or hobbyist experiments that involve the same things they do at work? How many people in other industries blog about their profession in their own time? And not just about their day to day, but about new things they've found or interesting things they've figured out. People want to go home and leave wo…

>How many people in other industries voluntarily embark on pet projects or hobbyist experiments that involve the same things they do at work?

Well this behavior isn't limited to those involved with software development. I'd say that this is the case for any profession that involves the formulation and then creation of content, ideas, products etc.

Take this guy for example: http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/culturebox/2012/01/the_be...

A lot of other fields necessitate a customer in order to perform, such as medicine.

Re: Could Coding Become the Next Mass Profession?

#60

Post by contextfree »

If programming (or CS concepts) were to become part of common literacy, that wouldn't necessarily mean programming qua profession would be the next mass profession. Writing is part of common literacy, but professional writers aren't a huge portion of the population. There are a lot more people who write in the course of their work in some other profession, though.
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