Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend • Hacker News Board

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#171

Post by drstewart » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:32 PM UTC

OnlineGladiator wrote: post #19

frellus wrote: post #10

I get the whole "HR can be evil" point, but this article could have also been, "Having friends in management is fine, but management is not your friend". Personally, I'm so sick of the cynicism in general. Can we make points and articles about protecting yourself, as an employee, without resorting to such things? As a manager in a company, I've both had friends in HR and also had HR been my friend. Need to fire that…

> Personally, I'm so sick of the cynicism in general. Personally, I'm so sick of there not being nearly enough cynicism in general. I've met cops that aren't total pieces of shit (who all ended up quitting in less than 5 years), but that doesn't mean cops aren't total pieces of shit. If the nature of the job is unethical, you should rightly call it out as such. HR's job is to pretend to be your friend while doing wha…

From my perspective, it's very clear from your tone why you and HR don't get along. Professionalism is probably not your strong suit.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#172

Post by abalashov » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:33 PM UTC

civilized wrote: post #8

abalashov wrote: post #5

Prior to going out on my own at a precociously young age, my time in corporate America (~3.5 years) was fairly brief, and less than half of it spent at companies large enough to have an HR apparatus in any meaningful sense. I always found their seeming double-agent role confusing and ambiguous in a slightly sinister way, even as they preached that they were there for us workforce people if we needed anything.

The dehumanizing name "Human Resources" says it all, doesn't it? We're not people. We're not even workers. We're just resources that happen to be members of the human species. Similar to other resources like staplers. There's no perfect euphemism for what HR does, but something like... I don't know... Workforce Management? Would be a little less awful, I think?

It's still common among recruiters and staffing companies. Back in the mid-2000s when I was last looking for jobs, it was the bane of my existence to be summoned as a "Linux resource" or something...

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#173

Post by rippercushions » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:34 PM UTC

vlod wrote: post #97

hardware2win wrote: post #31

I dont understand those bad experiences with HR here All hr stuff that ive been involved in was getting hired, questions about taxes, days off calculations and health provider related stuff Like... what happened to you?

When you're reliant on them, every single HR dept I've hard to deal with (across many companies) has been incompetent. It's too the point I have systems in place to cover their inevitable screw up. e.g. I was living in the US and had to go for a business trip to the UK and my company put up in the Ritz Carlton in London (a very fancy and very expensive hotel, especially during new year). However the HR person thought…

Unless your company is so tiny that the HR person is wearing many hats, the credit limit on your corp credit card is set by the finance team and likely has nothing at all to do with HR.

Although a $50 (!?) limit on a credit card sounds more like somebody at the bank fucked up.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#174

Post by Spoom » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:36 PM UTC

clownshoez wrote: post #136

Spoom wrote: post #21

HR represents the company. Where your goals and the company's aligns, they can be helpful. Where they diverge, perhaps less so. I think a lot of these sorts of articles discount the idea that your goals and the company's will frequently align. For example, if you're being harassed, it's very often in the company's interest to stop that happening. It will cause you and perhaps more people to quit if they don't, and th…

You're making the assumption that although you're being harassed the best outcome for you and the company are aligned. This is definitely not always the case, if you are being harassed and it happens to be in the best interest for the company to get rid of you, for whatever reason, guess what happens next?

HR will consider downside risk too. It's usually not the whole story to say that getting rid of you will be simple and easy. You might file a lawsuit. Your colleagues might be demoralized. Other teams might start hearing about the situation and protesting in various ways. The government might get involved. It might lead to bad PR.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#175

Post by maxbond » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:37 PM UTC

drstewart wrote: post #171

OnlineGladiator wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Personally, I'm so sick of the cynicism in general. Personally, I'm so sick of there not being nearly enough cynicism in general. I've met cops that aren't total pieces of shit (who all ended up quitting in less than 5 years), but that doesn't mean cops aren't total pieces of shit. If the nature of the job is unethical, you should rightly call it out as such. HR's job is to pretend to be your friend while doing wha…

From my perspective, it's very clear from your tone why you and HR don't get along. Professionalism is probably not your strong suit.

There's no reason to believe they speak to their coworkers in this way. This is a different context.

Edit out swipes please.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#176

Post by duxup » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:38 PM UTC

nerdponx wrote: post #157

duxup wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cynicism does seem like a race to the bottom. It’s to the point that discussions are derailed by it with folks who feign knowledge about a topic just offer cynicism. Anything that’s doesn’t work right the empty response is a conspiracy of “oh that’s by design” as if people would otherwise always have things working… It’s endless online.

It's always been possible to feign knowledge and wisdom with cynicism, even before public discourse was carried out "online". It's also always been possible to feign knowledge and wisdom with breathless enthusiasm or optimism. Fakery is fakery. In general, we are not cynical enough. Humans have been out to take advantage of each other for as long as we have recorded history, and probably for much longer than that. Ci…

> we are not cynical enough

What supports that conclusion?

Fear of being deceived?

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#177

Post by haberman » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:38 PM UTC

OnlineGladiator wrote: post #111

acover wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is the nature of being a cop unethical? I agree there are abuses of the power but from what I've seen in real life it's important work.

I should mention I am referring specifically to police in the United States. The short answer is because cops defend cops, including bad cops. People like to say it's just a few bad apples, but it's far more prevalent than that. And even if it were just 1 in 100, the fact that the cops band together to protect a rapist/murderer/whatever shows that they care more about unity than morals. I realize this answer is lacki…

> The short answer is because cops defend cops, including bad cops.

Show me a group that doesn't do this.

In Seattle's 2020 cop-free zone CHOP/CHAZ, the self-appointed "security forces" killed an unarmed 16-year-old. It's all on video, and the statements made by the assailants in the aftermath are heinous. Plenty of people were there to see it, but nobody's talking, and at this point it looks like they'll probably never catch the killers.

I don't excuse or accept bad behavior by cops. But I can't call policing unethical by nature unless you can show me an alternative that is more ethical. Seattle got an experiment in the alternative, and it was not good.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#178

Post by zelon88 » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:42 PM UTC

Anecdotal HR story: I got hurt at work once and required surgery. I came into work with this information and told my friendly, cheerful HR person the news. They closed the door to their office and began visibly stressing out about the workers comp claim. I wasn't being berated, but I was being questioned on my motive behind going to a hospital instead of the assigned "occupational health specialist" that the company employed.

The HR person literally said, verbatim, "Awww why didn't you go to OUR doctors? You went to a hospital? This is going to cost us a fortune!"

That really put HR into perspective for me.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#179

Post by rippercushions » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:43 PM UTC

orblivion wrote: post #132

I want to ask a really base level question. And maybe it doesn't relate to this article in particular. Why do I get the vibe that people talk about HR as if it's some sort of clandestine political power center in our society? Or is this is just a recent right wing talking point? I could maybe see a power struggle between "engineering" and "design" in a company like Apple. Is HR not just a basic managerial function th…

In a well-run company, HR stays in their lane and executes orders from management.

In all too many companies in the real world, management is a chaotic revolving door of political infighting, and HR has a great deal of power. I've worked in a team where an HR rep attended every personnel-related management meeting, and overruled performance ratings, promotions etc while the VP supposedly running the show played Candy Crush.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#180

Post by ChrisMarshallNY » Thu, Jan 05, 2023, 7:46 PM UTC

> HR exist to represent the interests of the company

In the company I worked for, HR was there to protect the C-Suite. There were two sets of rules: The ones for the executives, and the ones for everyone else.

It was pretty routine for us to get training (lots of training), telling us to avoid specific activities (like, say...f'rinstance, dating subordinates), yet we'd see the executives, doing exactly that, without a peep from HR.