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Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

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Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#791

Post by yieldcrv »

imwillofficial wrote: post #386
yieldcrv wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

save these goals for your non-profit the rest of us want revenue. there is no build it and they will come, its appealing to people's sentiments, and the people have to know its there at all.

Ah, questioning the morality of exploiting human nature is for non profits. Got it. There is a right way and a wrong way to achieve success. Profit is not the only thing that matters in life.

how did you get that interpretation from any of this?

regardless, a for-profit company should not use its runway on ideals as it won't last very long, it has to build and find ways to be known about beyond its small community. that's what this is about.

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#792

Post by yieldcrv »

opportune wrote: post #543
yieldcrv wrote: post #468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

read it again, its not about getting hired, its about getting capital and decision making roles that skip the corporate ladder. these have an overrepresentation of Ivy League MBAs in them with a pedigree that has nothing to do with promotions. People see the Ivy League MBA as key to this and aren’t interested in the other things an MBA can do. The jobs these disillusioned alumni have were attainable without the MBA.

There are very typical archetypes that benefit from top MBAs and if your background isn’t one of those, then it won’t help. For example I doubt an associate (who is black) at a major IB firm gets much worse outcomes from an Ivy League MBA than their white peers. If black people are over represented in the people who are admitted but not from those backgrounds that stand to most benefit, it would stand to reason their…

my first post covered all of this rehash posted as a rebuttal

"despite the small sample size"

"despite their ambitions"

for people with the typical archetype "it amplifies their ambition if they want"

"whether it has anything to do with their race or not"

"the “average salary” of MBA alumnis is not what is interesting about getting one"

the point is for more examples that show its not a waste of time for ambitious BIPOC, and what archetype would help integrate them into the archetype that often happens to also have an MBA. is it possible to obtain this archetype or are we really in a caste system.

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#793

Post by mixmastamyk »

layer8 wrote: post #324
ruune wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard it with a door for every port, but one door where you ask for that specific port works too!

I think “door” works better because any function can be behind any port, and it is a matter of convention, not of asking for a specific thing. I.e. when you connect to port 80 you don’t ask for HTTP, you just hope that’s what’s available at that port.

The word port is another for door in Latin based languages.

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#794

Post by carapace »

icepat wrote: post #790
andsoitis wrote: post #702

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> pre-scientific What does that mean?

Nothing. Either something follows the scientific method, or it does not. Pre-scientific is a fancy way of saying "we have no evidence for this". Bear in mind, this field is decades old, and has been subjected already to scientific study. All of which have debunked it. In the typical style of SCAMS (supplemental, complementary, and alternative medicines), this line really just means they're waiting for the one study t…

You don't have any actual experience with NLP do you?

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#795

Post by carapace »

icepat wrote: post #789
carapace wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's generally considered a pseudoscience. Only by people who have no experience with it. NLP ("Neurolinguistic Programming", not Natural Language Processing) is pre-scientific , yes, but that's not the same as being a pseudoscience, and calling it such is a disservice. We have pretty much discovered the operating system of the human mind. applying the principles and techniques discovered and systematized under the…

> learning and using this stuff every day Anecdotal evidence isn't evidence, it's anecdote. You're basing this all off what people are saying works for them. There's a strong possibility that having learned this gives them extra confidence/trying harder, which in tern leads them to improvements. It's like taking sugar pills telling someone it's amphetamine.

I wasn't cured of clinical depression by "extra confidence" or "trying harder".

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#796

Post by monero-xmr »

rramadass wrote: post #767
monero-xmr wrote: post #744

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OOP is successful despite of itself. My point is it’s just an inferior way of programming and there is no reason to use it other than legions of OOP programmers who take it as gospel. Obviously this is an opinion but it’s informed by lots of experience in new and legacy code bases.

To be blunt, you are stating "opinions" without any basis in facts; hence it is hard to take you seriously. Separation of Concerns, Modularization, Reusability, Type Hierarchies, Type Composition, Interface contract-based programming, Frameworks etc. were all made mainstream by OOD/OOP. These are things taken for granted by programmers today. As somebody who has been doing OOD/OOP since the early nineties i can tell…

The major reasons software exploded are the internet and the ubiquity of computing devices that get cheaper, faster, and smaller. Language had nothing to do with it, with or without OOP.

I was formally trained and cut my teeth in OOP code bases and my latest company we are very light on classes. 99% is plain objects and modules that operate on them. Everything is very straightforward and logical. In my side projects I’ve stopped using classes as well and it’s so much cleaner.

This is opinion and preference. If I hired a guy who wanted to litter the code base with AbstractUserBeanFactoryFactories I’d have to let them go because it’s a situation I don’t want anymore.

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#797

Post by dang »

dinkumthinkum wrote: post #519
carapace wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's generally considered a pseudoscience. Only by people who have no experience with it. NLP ("Neurolinguistic Programming", not Natural Language Processing) is pre-scientific , yes, but that's not the same as being a pseudoscience, and calling it such is a disservice. We have pretty much discovered the operating system of the human mind. applying the principles and techniques discovered and systematized under the…

I don’t really care about this one or the other but you’re taking about this thing exactly the way cultists do. It doesn’t lend it any credence. Why would the “evil scientists” be so against your ideology, specifically? Academics publish papers on all kinds of things. This is the same type of stuff of Gene Ray or flat-Earthers etc.

Please don't cross into personal attack or name-calling.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#798

Post by wreath »

whynaut wrote: post #761
wreath wrote: post #731

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But why does representation of different skin colors matter or ethnicity matters? There are very very few occasions where it does, but in most everyday situations like work, sports etc it really doesn't. I'd rather be classified by an attribute that's relevant to the situation such as skill level or expertise rather than arbitrary attribute like my skin color, why not my height or color of my teeth instead?

Didn't we already establish upthread why it matters? Why are we backtracking 5 comments deep?

Where was that? I must have missed it.

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#799

Post by icepat »

carapace wrote: post #794
icepat wrote: post #790

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing. Either something follows the scientific method, or it does not. Pre-scientific is a fancy way of saying "we have no evidence for this". Bear in mind, this field is decades old, and has been subjected already to scientific study. All of which have debunked it. In the typical style of SCAMS (supplemental, complementary, and alternative medicines), this line really just means they're waiting for the one study t…

You don't have any actual experience with NLP do you?

No, but I'm trained as a scientist, so I know how to read research, data, and scientific studies. I don't need to have experience with Scientology to tell you that, based on the available evidence, it's bunk. Nor do I need experience with homeopathy to tell you that water-memory is unscientific and nonsense. Direct, personal experience, isn't how the scientific community collects data, and converts that data into knowledge. It's rigorous study, and testing. NLP has been subjected to that, and it has failed to stand up.

Re: Ask HN: Concepts that clicked only years after you first encountered them?

#800

Post by icepat »

carapace wrote: post #795
icepat wrote: post #789

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> learning and using this stuff every day Anecdotal evidence isn't evidence, it's anecdote. You're basing this all off what people are saying works for them. There's a strong possibility that having learned this gives them extra confidence/trying harder, which in tern leads them to improvements. It's like taking sugar pills telling someone it's amphetamine.

I wasn't cured of clinical depression by "extra confidence" or "trying harder".

This is a case of correlation, plus (again) totally unsubstantiated anecdotal claims. Suggesting people use unproven, non-evidence based approaches, to an illness that leads almost a million people a year to take their own lives, is reckless and potentially harmful. You believe NLP "technology" worked for you -- cool. Some people believe taking LSD worked for them -- cool. Some people say L. Ron Hubbard's "technology" has helped them. I won't take that away from them, but if they start pushing it on other, that's deeply wrong.

There's plenty of evidence-based methodologies that work for statistically significant portions of the population; and those are administered by doctors, and professionals.

But where you cross the line is when you start telling other people to do this too, and that it will work. I won't take the fact that you found something helpful in this. People find all sorts of different things helpful. But I firmly believe that you trying to make this sound like a sure thing is immoral and dangerous.

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