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How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

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Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#201

Post by majewsky »

flohofwoe wrote: post #190

Funny how the more the screenshots go back in history, the more 'useful' the UI looks like (even though they no longer adhere to the current fashion fad - which should actually be handled through a user-accessible themeing engine, no need to pay some UI designers big bucks to come up with rounded corners). For instance right in the first Task Manager screenshot, I have no clue what those tab icons on the left side ac…

The newer UIs also seem to be lacking a clear visual hierarchy. The Task Manager screenshot feels quite cluttered to me, not because of the amount of information presented (which is actually well-balanced IMO), but because different parts of the view are not properly separated from each other visually. The biggest offender is probably the scrollbar between the stack of summary graphs on the left and the stack of CPU graphs on the right. This scrollbar would work way better in the "old" style, with a frame that extends over the entire height of the scrollable viewport, since that frame would provide a clearer boundary between left and right.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#202

Post by vehemenz »

piyush_soni wrote: post #114
kzrdude wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No cut for files is not bizarre in a macOS world of course, just from your expectations.

No, it's not from "just my expectations". I can understand that things work differently in different OSs, and having the same expectations from it won't be correct. There are also many on the internet who defend this design choice of giving no 'Cut' option for files saying "it is more natural/intuitive this way for how humans think", well, then you should not give 'Cut/Paste' even in your built-in Text Editor just to…

The things you are complaining about take a week, at most, to adjust to. I am a former Windows user who switched to Macs about seven years ago.

Enter for rename is perfectly sensible to me. Personally, I use it more than Cmd+Down to open files.

The Cmd+C + Cmd+Shift+V paradigm for cut/paste makes just as much sense as the Windows paradigm. Either way it's a just copy and delete function. Would you rather choose to delete at the time of the "paste" or at the "copy?" I don't see a clear reason to prefer one over the other.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#204

Post by hulitu »

petepete wrote: post #123
adql wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, if you're UI designer and designed the UIs launched it and all works... what else you're going to do ? Same disease that plagues GNOME, change shit for sake of changing shit, fuck users that got used to the old way, they don't matter, is new way faster ? Who knows, we don't.

It's funny how the huge silent majority get on just fine with GNOME but the vocal few act like the devs have poked them in the eye and called their mother fat.

the huge silent majority does not use Gnome.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#205

Post by whywhywhywhy »

piyush_soni wrote: post #39
dochtman wrote: post #4

I would be curious for a similar dissection of modern macOS. My intuitive sense is that it is a little better though there are probably still at least 5 layers of stuff. So to some extent, does doing this better at the scale of a modern user-facing OS provide enough return on investment?

Unpopular opinion: Windows UI has a lot of problems, but it's still much more intuitive and stupid-proof than macOS. Having worked with both, macOS is just inconsistent to the core (and Finder is an application one would have to pay a team of developers with the core instruction of 'make it a non-intuitive and unusable mess'). Also, I still use apps last maintained in 2010 on the latest Windows version, while apps wr…

>Finder is an application one would have to pay a team of developers with the core instruction of 'make it a non-intuitive and unusable mess'

Some people seem to hate it but for me it’s absolute joy to use and the only file manager designed properly and for power users.

Explorer totally falls apart once files in a folder are in the 10,000s performance anside its sorting and search are anemic compared to Finder.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#206

Post by kevincox »

AlexandrB wrote: post #184

> Last, but not least, the boot screen has been updated to the new Windows logo, as well as the new WinUI loading circle, which replaces the dated spinning dots. I guess this is why I'm not a designer, but why are the spinning dots dated and why is that bad?

My understanding is that the spinning dots are dates because they launched a new UI style which uses a different spinner.

They are dated simply because there is something newer.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#207

Post by swayvil »

323 wrote: post #154
alentred wrote: post #30

To be fair, I think some examples, and specifically those from 95/NT and then 3.1 times, are too far-fetched. I agree that consistency is important, but it doesn't mean that every screen needs to be redesigned altogether. For instance, I don't think that examples of Screen Saver Settings or File Properties are relevant, as long as their styling is in line with the rest of the OS. One thing that surprises me a lot, th…

One universal solution that works for all apps - you render the app in an off-screen buffer and pass that to AI to re-render it in the new style. This way you don't need to touch the code. AI could also translate mouse clicks/coordinates accordingly if it moves stuff around. You could even have "UI themes", tell the AI to re-render in Windows 2000/XP/11 style. EDIT: the downvotes I'm getting with no comments are funn…

It's a good idea. I'm interested to see how much AI can improve UI and its development. Automatic dev aside, there's a whole world of flexibility and dynamicness there that we probably aren't even seeing because it's such a hairball.

Imagine a UI that guesses what you are trying to achieve and optimizes itself appropriately on the fly.

(And yes, tweaks all the fonts, palettes, etc to look nice too).

UI designed by humans could be a thing of the past. We could just feed the AI references to the variables we want the user to view/twiddle and the AI would do the rest.

(I hate writing UI)

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#208

Post by tpush »

Karunamon wrote: post #192
bayindirh wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, yes, but if most people who is going to give feedback are tech-inclined Linux people and your aim is to build something which can be used by anyone at the end? Your initial design might land somewhere very wrong, but starting to ask for feedback from that point on will lead you better since it's wrong for everyone , no?

The word for the audience that GNOME developers are targeting is "lowest common denominator". It's the same problem with all excessively friendly interfaces, great if you are a day one user (pretty rare on Linux), obstructive and shitty if you know what you're doing.

I know what I'm doing and generally like Gnome.

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#209

Post by akersten »

flohofwoe wrote: post #190

Funny how the more the screenshots go back in history, the more 'useful' the UI looks like (even though they no longer adhere to the current fashion fad - which should actually be handled through a user-accessible themeing engine, no need to pay some UI designers big bucks to come up with rounded corners). For instance right in the first Task Manager screenshot, I have no clue what those tab icons on the left side ac…

It's not just looks, there are real features missing from the new control panel activities too, and I don't look forward to the day the old ones are removed. For example, to disable a network adapter, you have to go into the Vista/7 version of Network settings so you can right click it and get the context menu. It's a mess!

Re: How many layers of UI inconsistencies are in Windows 11?

#210

Post by phpisthebest »

numpad0 wrote: post #196
phpisthebest wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dont like either, both take their lead from mac os, which I also do not like I am a gnome2 person, KDE, win7, etc type UI, if I wanted a mac I would buy a mac. There was a post on here a few months ago from a former MS engineer talking about how a large part of MS design team were all MAC users.

A lot of junior webdevs, iOS app devs and designers were buying Macs to run testing/staging envs, and they have a lot of leverages, so MS had to do what they did.

Outsized influence IMO.

Enterprise is still king, and we here in Enterprise Ops are not happy. Microsoft needs to remember where its money comes from, and it is not jr webdevs

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