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AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

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Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#101

Post by kristiandupont »

I can imagine a future where it's quite easy to fake real people. By gathering information, pictures and maybe even videos of a person, you might be able to deep fake a credible video of them. It might know their address and use pictures and Streetview material to have them "record" a video from their house.

That means that a clever script would be able to figure out who a persons real friends are (that info is easily obtained already today), and create personalised videos from said friends. In such a scenario it might not be the Great Logging off, but it would certainly be a situation where you think "I had breakfast with my friend and he said X to my face, so I can believe it.", but anything online can be considered noise.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#102

Post by baxtr »

pmontra wrote: post #62

This is why I quit social media years ago. There is no difference between a stream of posts from strangers and a stream of posts from bots. What I care is interaction with friends and FB wouldn't give it to me or not as effectively as WhatsApp and Telegram. So I ended up with WhatsApp groups and Telegram channels where I know first hand most of the people or more rarely I'm at one hop from them. The only place where…

So does this mean you wouldn’t qualify HN as social media?

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#103

Post by tapanjk »

> but even if that hits us tomorrow, the amount of raw power that's been unlocked in the last year alone – the tech that's already here – already has the potential to change things in massive waves.

If this is about ChatGPT, we should remember that it is not available in a way that you can build your business applications on top of it in any reliable or meaningful way. It is a very powerful demo of what AI can do, but nothing more yet. Also, OpenAI is spending a lot just to let you and me give it a try and this will not last long. IIRC, they are burning something in the range of 3 million USD per day.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#104

Post by seydor »

visarga wrote: post #74
seydor wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It isn't so much about vetting participants than about moderating the discourse , which is hard to do right, and usually relegated to the few people who are willing to do it for free , which is bad quality (like reddit) Ai can be used to moderate discussions however , if it is trained to remove low effort in an unbiased way

> It isn't so much about vetting participants than about moderating the discourse Vetting, moderating ... none of them scale well when done manually. The solution I see is that everyone have their own AI filters, customised as they see fit. You can include or exclude specific people and topics, make it as diverse or narrow as you like, allow challenging opinions or not. One of the filters can be to detect AI bots. Do…

> none of them scale well when done manually.

Then maybe we should reduce the scale of the megaphones. Current networks are just unpleasant because it's mass hysteria on global level. Scale isn't everything.

I think future forum owners will be continuously finetuning their AI filters to fit their community standards.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#105

Post by OhioMan2943 »

OgAstorga wrote: post #30
seydor wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is as much spam as there is email. Did people quit email?

There is more than twice spam as there is legitimate email (source: ran a corporate email server). However, so far most spam is automatically detected. In the near future, It's likely that this is no longer going to be the case and in the moment that most of your email is spam you are going to stop trusting everything you receive. Even right now inside corps people already (should?) distrust and double checks everyth…

I can't help but wonder how we will ensure official government/legal->user communication is legitimate in the face of software that can dodge spam filters at a whim. Is it back to letters for us?

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#106

Post by dmurray »

kristiandupont wrote: post #101

I can imagine a future where it's quite easy to fake real people. By gathering information, pictures and maybe even videos of a person, you might be able to deep fake a credible video of them. It might know their address and use pictures and Streetview material to have them "record" a video from their house. That means that a clever script would be able to figure out who a persons real friends are (that info is easil…

Hard to imagine that there couldn't be any kind of trusted (perhaps encrypted, but not necessarily) communication online.

Text conversations are trivial to fake, and WhatsApp could trivially MITM a handful of conversations and tell me my friend said something different and I'd never know. But they have an incentive not to do this at a large scale, because there are benefits of running a worldwide trusted messaging service, and they would fear people would move to alternatives when millions of messages started being adulterated.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#108

Post by donkeyd »

angarg12 wrote: post #25

Regarding the Third point, I can already see part of this movement. I've become disenchanted with the quality of the discourse. Specifically as I've entered a more senior stage of my career, I'm looking to mingle with like-minded folks in similar situations. Thing is, these folks don't usually lurk online, and even if they do, their voices get overwhelmed by the flood of (mostly low quality) content. I'd be happy to…

> their voices get overwhelmed by the flood of (mostly low quality) content

I have the same issue. People place so much trust in their preferred sources of information and don't question anything they read. Because of this I have a hard time discussing anything beyond the most basic things with many friends, since they just repeat talking points and opinions of others.

It's so enlightening when I do find someone who's well read on a subject and can have an actual conversation about it. Even better if they have a different opinion and give you some new bit of information that makes you think about your opinions or perception of knowledge. Or, when you can agree to disagree because you have the similar understanding of a subject, but have different values or preferences. Moments like that can make me really happy sometimes.

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#109

Post by seydor »

OhioMan2943 wrote: post #99
clnq wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet is full of lemons, not only social media, SEO-influenced services, and services where money buys you reach. If you take any popular medical fact (for example, about diets), you will find countless published academic articles supporting and against it. This extends into other fields like physics, sociology, and politics too. But the contradictions there (while present) are not as overtly visible. Many pop…

I am interested to see which social media platforms double down on welcoming ai generated content and catering to the remaining users that prefer addictive content to social connection. This is speculative but we may see a very strong pivot from the "social" aspect to the addictive content aspect in publicly listed social media companies in order to continue to appease shareholders, which could, possibly, accelerate…

Yep. Customizable TV is the future

Re: AI: Markets for Lemons, and the Great Logging Off

#110

Post by sokoloff »

seydor wrote: post #95
wkat4242 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the discussion between carefully vetted participants needs to be moderated. We go for moderation too quickly these days. Of course if someone goes crazy they should be banned but in less extreme scenarios a well chosen group should behave, just like it's but necessary to moderate a social gathering in real life.

but it s exclusionary which defeats the purpose of the internet as an open forum

What is the underlying purpose of an open forum? Is it the openness itself, or something that openness allows? I think it’s the latter: allowing people with common interests who wouldn’t otherwise connect in real life to interact meaningfully.

If that’s the case, 100.00% open might not be optimal if 99.9% open yields better results for the resulting community.

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