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72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

washingtonpost.com

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Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#81

Post by wolverine876 »

cm2187 wrote: post #36
wolverine876 wrote: post #7

A major problem in our society is that '72-year-old' is in the headline. If you are not growing, you are declining or dead. Not only does the world change under your feet, you need that stimulation just to stay healthy. We ruin the talent, economic value, and freedom and opportunity of a very large portion of the population by dimissing the growth of anyone in late middle-age or later. 72 years old shouldn't be remar…

The reality is that most people's mental abilities have started to decline by this age, particularly the capacity to learn new things. That makes this story all the more remarkable. Part of that I think is certainly as you suggest, that the brain is a muscle, you need to use it to keep it fit. But you can't escape nature either. To keep the muscle analogy, you won’t compete as an athlete at 72 no matter how fit you r…

> Part of that I think is certainly as you suggest, that the brain is a muscle, you need to use it to keep it fit.

My claim, which admittedly is hard to substantiate, is that growth (a general term) will offset aging to a much greater degree than people imagine. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if psychological and physiological aging of the brain is mostly due to lack of growth.

> To keep the muscle analogy, you won’t compete as an athlete at 72 no matter how fit you remain.

I think the muscle analogy can be a useful one, but that it misleads here: Muscles start deteriorating at age 20 or 25; our brains do not on balance (they do in some ways, and improve in others). Peak mental performance is, IIRC, in our 40s and 50s.

Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#82

Post by wolverine876 »

pleb_nz wrote: post #63
cm2187 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They may not be competitive against folks 20+ years younger than themselves that's kind of my point. Of course they can compete against other 72 year olds.

Why does it have to be a competition. Shouldn't it be about being able to help and contribute. Too much focus on efficiency and not enough on well being of society as a whole. 80 year olds with a desire can still contribute. It doesn't have to be in competition with 20 years.

IME almost all 80 year olds can contribute much more than 20 year olds for any mental task, beyond super-demanding cognitive work like high-level math or some coding.

Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#83

Post by aliswe »

bmitc wrote: post #68
wolverine876 wrote: post #7

A major problem in our society is that '72-year-old' is in the headline. If you are not growing, you are declining or dead. Not only does the world change under your feet, you need that stimulation just to stay healthy. We ruin the talent, economic value, and freedom and opportunity of a very large portion of the population by dimissing the growth of anyone in late middle-age or later. 72 years old shouldn't be remar…

I get what you’re saying, but I think it’s a little too much to call it a “major problem”. Getting a master’s degree is a ceremonial task that has basically no meaning other than what certain jobs may require or want, usually jobs at the beginning of one’s career. Getting a master’s at 72 is kind of weird I think, since he could just as easily learn the material without the degree by taking selective courses. Getting…

I understand that you're kind of taking the middle ground here, but still this is not short of gatekeeping.

Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#84

Post by Barrin92 »

onion2k wrote: post #51
wolverine876 wrote: post #7

A major problem in our society is that '72-year-old' is in the headline. If you are not growing, you are declining or dead. Not only does the world change under your feet, you need that stimulation just to stay healthy. We ruin the talent, economic value, and freedom and opportunity of a very large portion of the population by dimissing the growth of anyone in late middle-age or later. 72 years old shouldn't be remar…

If you are not growing, you are declining or dead. What's wrong with retiring and living out your last years peacefully relaxing with your hobbies and family? There's absolutely no reason why people have to continually grow until they're in the ground. You're applying an adage about companies to people, but companies need to fight against inflation, and people don't.

>What's wrong with retiring and living out your last years peacefully relaxing with your hobbies and family?

in reality it's a lot less enticing than it sounds. Younger family tends to move on with their own life, and spouses and older relatives tend to die once you get old.

Working in older age gives you a wide social circle, stimulation and purpose that is desperately needed if you want to stay healthy and especially mentally fit. I've seen it so often that as soon as people retire they decline like crazy. Hobbies don't sustain anyone.

Even the mentality of "my last days" already sounds like you're clocking out. Every day might be your last day, even when you're not old.

Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#85

Post by wolverine876 »

echelon wrote: post #56
cm2187 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reality is that most people's mental abilities have started to decline by this age, particularly the capacity to learn new things. That makes this story all the more remarkable. Part of that I think is certainly as you suggest, that the brain is a muscle, you need to use it to keep it fit. But you can't escape nature either. To keep the muscle analogy, you won’t compete as an athlete at 72 no matter how fit you r…

> The reality is that most people's mental abilities have started to decline by this age, particularly the capacity to learn new things. I agree with the first statement, but more of a function of accumulated metabolic and cognitive dysfunction than merely age. I don't think the second statement necessarily follows. Time spent fully engrossed in a subject, where the learner is able to put away their ego and learn as…

> Time spent fully engrossed in a subject, where the learner is able to put away their ego and learn as a child would, is what is conducive to good learning. That can happen at any age, but in practice, seldom does due to the demanding structure of adult life.

That's what I'm talking about, but don't blame some external force for that outcome. It's a choice; it's about priorities. If you give yourself time for a little growth, I think you'll net much greater productivity overall - including emotional presence for your family.

Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#86

Post by arcturus17 »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #28
wolverine876 wrote: post #7

A major problem in our society is that '72-year-old' is in the headline. If you are not growing, you are declining or dead. Not only does the world change under your feet, you need that stimulation just to stay healthy. We ruin the talent, economic value, and freedom and opportunity of a very large portion of the population by dimissing the growth of anyone in late middle-age or later. 72 years old shouldn't be remar…

> 72 years old shouldn't be remarkable, but the norm. Having neither of my parents even make it to 72, I’m pessimistic. I hope I will be lucky that my health allows me to keep learning and doing cool stuff at that age (and that I’m actually alive), but the sad reality is that health and genetics can be against us, and being in a healthy thriving state at 72 is more an exception than the norm.

Sorry about your parents... I wouldn't want wish anyone to lose them early. I also understand that genetics sometimes are an unescapeable force.

On the bright side however, life expectancy is growing worldwide. In Spain, where I live, average expectancy before Covid peaked at 84 years old. In the US it was 79. The difference is irrelevant to my point (I have no clue what the cause is); the fact is in both cases the stat has grwon explosively in the last 50 years [1] [2]

Likewise there is dramatic progress being made against cancer [3] and other deadly diseases.

Down to everyday life, I am constantly amazed by what some 70 year olds look like nowadays.

I don't lead a perfect lifestyle, but the idea of being able to get a degree on a complex topic like AI in the 70's definitely inspires me to at least try and tilt the odds in my favor to get to that age in good standing. The amount of information and inexpensive tools at our disposal today is staggering.

[1] https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.DYN.LE00.IN?location...

[2] https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.DYN.LE00.IN?location...

[3] https://ourworldindata.org/cancer#is-the-world-making-progre...

Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#89

Post by pkaye »

When I attended a California UC and CSU university, I met some seniors who were getting a engineering degree just for fun. At that time I think California seniors could attend courses with no tuition. This was all 20-30 year ago. I think that is still true for the CSU system but not sure about UC system.

I had some interesting conversation with some individuals. One used to work for engineers in the Navy and wanted to understand more of what they did. Another was involved in some early work on lithium battery technologies and wanted to understand software engineering.

Re: 72-year-old Congressman pursues a Master's in AI

#90

Post by neilv »

> The proctor administering an exam in his pre-calc class this spring leaned in and whispered, “What are you doing here?” as Beyer handed in his test.

I could read that multiple ways, but it doesn't sound good, not when we should already be sensitized not to discourage people.

Imagine saying that to a more familiar kind of less-represented student.

The next time someone asks why a university needs initiatives in diversity and inclusion, this is one argument for why: it's an unsolved problem.

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