One question that always seems to be unclear and insufficiently negotiated is reciprocity. What is the US going to offer in return. If they do offer to reciprocate, it actually needs to be delivered before the deal is live. That said, I think it is a shitty deal for these leaky, insecure, bad faith entities to be able to negotiate off to the side with our sensitive personal data like this.
The USA offers to continue the free visa agreement. If that ends, for reciprocity there won't be free visas for USA travelers to Europe too. It's lose lose but one of the two parties is always going to lose more than the other one. Which one? In the case of tourism probably Europe loses more from less USA tourists because of visa friction than the USA loses from European tourists staying at home. Business? It will ta…
US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
211–220 of 432 posts
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
What distinction would you draw between these two groups of data?
Intrusively versus non-intrusively acquired? It's just a feeling I have and I don't think that I'm alone on this.
One topic is around the dependability and practicality of such metrics as authenticators. The other topic is around surveillance and anonymity. The overlap is in the question of whether we have control over whether we are being authenticated or not. When used in a transactional system, we need to couple our authenticated identity with some positive action to give consent, i.e. that we want the transaction to occur and we accept the responsibilities of being one party to the transaction. In a surveillance system, we are being identified and our movements or actions attributed to us whether we want to or not.
Both topics have a potential for false positives and false negatives. Can someone "steal" my identity by impersonating me and causing transactions or other activities to be attributed to me without my knowledge? Or can someone through violence or coercion cause me to participate in these transactions or other activities against my will? Does the introduction of the authentication system reduce the risks or make them worse?
To what degree can we live our lives without displaying our identity to the public at large and/or while being able to assume some of our movements or activities can be kept confidential? We can choose whether to have our names or ID numbers emblazoned on our clothes. We can choose how often to present other non-biological identifiers like payment cards or mobile phones. It is much less practical to conceal our externally visible biometrics. The databases combining our biometrics and other identifiers continually shift the balance here, as it becomes ever easier to tie different observations together without our consent.
To be honest, I am not even sure whether I should care about the biometrics access being discussed in the original post. Generally, international travelers are already exposing their identities and movements not just at border controls but also via commercial bookings and interactions throughout their travel. I think I am more disgusted by the commercial brokers trying to create total information awareness of consumers than I am of governments monitoring border travel. The commercial brokers are trying to create a much finer-grained record of activities for everybody.
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#213Saddest is that in order to fight tax avoidance, when an European creates an account in an European bank you need to sign a separate statement that you are not an american citizen. I am not sure if they share data only of US citizens (or those with two citizenships), or all... but I also doubt that americans have to sign a document where they admit if they have a second citizenship in one of EU states. It feels very…
Not sure what you're arguing for? To make EU or EU state tax law as insane as the US tax law? The US is effectively able to bully other nations because of the US dollar and access to the banking system...
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#214I sincerely hope that the EU will give the appropriate but unprintable response to this request. At the time the biometric data was first collected plenty of people warned about this exact thing and we were repeatedly assured that it would never happen. Let's see if that is still true today. Never is such a long time...
As a US citizen I would absolutely love that (a short, unprintable answer from the EU to the US). And would cheer if the EU were in a position to deliver this. But... The way it looks to me (sorry, not trying to offend) is that while the EU may be an OK construct for the peacetime prosperity it is not functioning well during the times of conflict. As of today, it does not have military strength, energy security or ec…
Here, everyone left to right were saying, this will never happen.
The people who said that are all retired wealthy, their parties still exist, let us hold them accountable.
They always say they will get something in exchange, but it is all lies, the moment you are bargaining for something in exchange, youve already lost.
Keep in mind, never give anything to the EU either, they cannot be trusted blindly either, theyre just somewhat more accountable. If they would be the worlds superpower, I am not sure how benevolent they would be.
Everywhere on earth, the regular citizens have the same domestic nuissance, snoopi governments, all parties somehow collecting big data as if it were their business model.
Anyone who knows a lawyer, a govt tax agency worker and such will know, the data tue govt has will never be used for good, it will even be twisted in their favor.
Left or right does not matter, probably never did, if we had democracies, theycall such things bipartisan, the total left or right wing goverments had leaders like franco, pinochet, mao, stalin and such.
Anarchists keep saying the biggest atrocities were always from governments, not sure what to say about that, governmnents are always humans as well.
There is some issue at hand with power. Even in Switzerland, with its "direct democracy", the police state is quite invasive, discretly in the background.
Maybe human civilization is simply still in its infancy regarding governing the population.
100 years ago we had ww1, bit more back, feudalism etc.
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why would we have to give two damns about American demands, I don't see that having any chance.
The whole EU economy depends on the USD-EUR liquidity swap line between the two central banks. Basically EU has to do whatever US wants.
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
Given the US has army bases all in and around Europe, more than any European country, I bet the US wouldn't comply. That's been declining: 430,000 US troops in Europe in the '50s, and about 60,000 at the beginning of this year. https://www.boisestate.edu/bluereview/troops-in-europe/
> That’s been declining: 430,000 US troops in Europe in the ’50s, and about 60,000 at the beginning of this year. That’s been increasing, up to over 100,000 in June of this year. https://www.defense.gov/News/Releases/Release/Article/307805...
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is very correct. However, I would amend your solution: the solution is modern encryption and open source. These two in conjunction allow you to verify trust. ToS is like HR: they both exist to protect only the company.
Let's say hypothetically, Facebook buys Signal. They get all the code and signing keys, then use those to push a new update to the Signal app. This update decrypts your messages using the key on your device, then sends those decrypted messages to Facebook. What are you going to do about it? Call your senators, who are now in love with Facebook for giving the federal government access to these previously private commu…
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
What is the US going to offer in return. I suspect, without proof but read next paragraphs for some evidence, that the US offer their surveillance net. If EU police is searching for someone, even in our own territory, it's easier for US intelligence agencies to locate and eavesdrop on the suspect with the tech that we know. El Pollo Carvajal [0] was arrested in Madrid, September 2021. Although it was our police that…
This all worked without this approach, this is why interpol and fbi have collaborative projects.
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
As a regular US traveler, I'm ok with that if the alternative is handing over EU citizens data to a known bad actor.
I mean it sounds like you’d be giving up all the same data just through a slower process. From the presentation: For all travellers (and asylum seekers) before entry into USA Hit/ No hit query of the foreign databases On hit: retrieval of existing data record in pull procedure A part of visa issuance by a U.S. Embassy is a background check against both US databases and those of the local country. I believe all visa a…
So the change is the “watch list” lookup / handover of records for hits. Hate to be in the camp saying that “if you haven’t done anything wrong you have nothing to worry about” but I honestly assumed that those checks were already done.
Re: US Government demands direct police access to European biometric data [pdf]
#220How would the US react to the same request from EU's police? Would they give direct access to their people's biometric data? Conversely, what would the EU do if that same request came from another nation instead of the USA? What about Brazil, Japan, China?
Given the US has army bases all in and around Europe, more than any European country, I bet the US wouldn't comply. It's rarely talked about, but you gotta imagine, the fact the US controls most of the land and sea is a big factor in how diplomatic issues are resolved. I don't think this is a great thing, btw.
We are talking about a sub-set of security instruments and preventions, one of the many available, are we sure that an armed conflict - or just threat - would worth the trouble?