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2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

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Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#101

Post by srcreigh »

jraph wrote: post #92
Arbortheus wrote: post #5

Is there any Linux distribution with MacOS levels of reliability, simplicity, and productivity, that can reliably be updated without the boot partition getting full, random things like thunderbolt docks not working, or sleep states being faulty (or the machine not working properly after waking from sleep), or external monitor resolutions being wrong, and monitor scaling working properly when you have two monitors wit…

> without the boot partition getting full This is very annoying. Some distributions are able to boot directly from the main partition, without a need for a separate /boot though, even with Btrfs. This is the case for the computer I'm writing this comment with running openSUSE Tumbleweed, I think I had that with Debian or Ubuntu in the past. [a] > sleep states being faulty (or the machine not working properly after wa…

What partition configuration do you have? Do you have a fdisk printout handy (aka `fdisk /dev/FOOBAR` and run the p command)

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#102

Post by hyperpape »

LarryMullins wrote: post #75
spaceman_2020 wrote: post #39

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

There's no singular 'linux experience', all the problems you list are expected problems with some software on linux, but work just fine with other software systems on linux. Unfortunately many of the defaults chosen by Ubuntu are very poor and give bad first impressions. I think that recommending Ubuntu is an anachronism from the mid to late 00s. Experience makes it all much easier, simply because you learn which sof…

> There's no singular 'linux experience'

True, there’s two:

1. Complaining about your experience, only to be told that someone else doesn’t have problems because they’re better at it than you.

2. Being the guy who says he’s better.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#103

Post by LarryMullins »

rietta wrote: post #64
spaceman_2020 wrote: post #39

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

Not my experience at all. Been running Ubuntu LTS for work for years and updates are just about bulletproof.

Novice Linux users often make the mistake of adding third party repos to their package manager, which almost invariably causes trouble down the line. Some distros (for instance Debian) have a culture of discouraging this practice, while others (particularly Ubuntu) have a user culture which encourages it.

This is easily the most common reason for updates breaking. RPM and dpkg are both nigh bullet proof, and you can generally count on most distros to keep their own package repo in good order. Dependency resolution between out of sync and uncoordinated package repos is where things start to break down.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#104

Post by Kukumber »

Arbortheus wrote: post #58
Kukumber wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bugs? sounds like they misconfigured their OS Linux is not a commercial product that'll suit everyone all at once, you need to learn about its components, linux is just a kernel If your argumentation is "various linux bugs", then you should stick to Windows, it has nice "various windows bugs", or macos, it has nice "various macos bugs" There must be a reason why linux empowers the world from micro controllers to data…

In principle I would love to use Linux, as the developer experience isn’t great on Windows, and I would rather not be tied into expensive Apple computers. However, I don’t want to learn about components of my operating system, that is below my pay grade. I’m not trying to spread FUD, I’m speaking firsthand on some of the experiences my colleagues have had with their brand new $3000 business Thinkpads running all mann…

Your points doesn't make sense since you expect Linux to be Windows, it is not Windows

If you need Windows you use Windows

If you need an OS that is configurable and open, you use Linux

If you don't like to configure your OS, then you don't use Linux

That's not "elitism", that's respecting the work done by countless people to offer a free and configurable OS without strings attached

There is FUD in OP's comment since my original reply to tell people to use what empowers them got downvoted, -3 pts right now

"FUD: Fear, uncertainty and doubt is a propaganda tactic used in sales, marketing, public relations, politics, polling and cults. FUD is generally a strategy to influence perception by disseminating negative and dubious or false information and a manifestation of the appeal to fear."

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#105

Post by krick »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #39

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

Actually, I don't imagine switching to Windows or anything because I find writing a bash-script much easier than constantly dealing with the fact some things just aren't (realistically) configurable at all, and I absolutely hate dropdown menus within menus and having to use a mouse for everything.

That said, Windows/MacOS are MUCH more stable. Granted, I didn't use them nearly as much, as I use Linux (mainly Ubuntu and mainly LTS versions), but I basically didn't encounter any hardware-specific bugs at all for the last couple of years. Or some deep ecosystem problem, like all this Pulseaudio bullshit.

Linux is really frustrating, and I'm starting to actually lose hope we'll live to see it becoming, you know, usable.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#106

Post by jraph »

nverno wrote: post #77
jorvi wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What frustrates me is that other Linux users will tell you with a straight face that you must be flat-out lying if you bring up sleep problems. Had three users tell me that on HN just about a day ago.

Yea, but this is something unique to Linux, since everyone runs a different distro on different, never 100%-supported, hardware. So, they likely have never run into sleep problems- my desktop linux box doesn't have any at the moment. Sometimes these difficulties have a silver lining, though, after they force you to learn more about the systems you're using. I thinks it's less of a trial-by-fire than it was even four…

It indeed depends on the hardware. I had computers with capricious suspend in the past. The last ones worked fine, except one which sometimes hung on wake up and sometimes had graphical glitches and random hangs, but all this went away when I removed the faulty RAM stick it had…

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#107

Post by taurath »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #39

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

It always feels like a build-it-yourself vehicle. Using it as a daily driver when you need to get to work on time is not advised. Even when you get it running for a while, the breakage is inevitable, and you'll be under the hood. It is really cool if you love to tinker. Its an OS with a lower level of abstraction, and one that is less productive overall for most users, especially anyone who needs things to just work consistently.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#108

Post by gundamdoubleO »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #39

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

Never had any issues with Ubuntu past 16.04, at least not anything requiring bash scripts or issues with restarting. Still wouldn't recommend it to non-technical users though, but that's because 1) They'd have to let me install it for them, and 2) That would probably lead to me being tech support, which I don't have time for.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#109

Post by LarryMullins »

hyperpape wrote: post #102
LarryMullins wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no singular 'linux experience', all the problems you list are expected problems with some software on linux, but work just fine with other software systems on linux. Unfortunately many of the defaults chosen by Ubuntu are very poor and give bad first impressions. I think that recommending Ubuntu is an anachronism from the mid to late 00s. Experience makes it all much easier, simply because you learn which sof…

> There's no singular 'linux experience' True, there’s two: 1. Complaining about your experience, only to be told that someone else doesn’t have problems because they’re better at it than you. 2. Being the guy who says he’s better.

And then there's this guy, who gets mad at people who share positive experiences because he thinks the discussion is the rightful territory of those who want to complain.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#110

Post by severine »

JadeNB wrote: post #85
LarryMullins wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no singular 'linux experience', all the problems you list are expected problems with some software on linux, but work just fine with other software systems on linux. Unfortunately many of the defaults chosen by Ubuntu are very poor and give bad first impressions. I think that recommending Ubuntu is an anachronism from the mid to late 00s. Experience makes it all much easier, simply because you learn which sof…

> I think that recommending Ubuntu is an anachronism from the mid to late 00s. What would you recommend as a modern-day user-friendly Linux experience? I've been looking for something not too demanding to put on an old X220.

MX-Linux, hands down. The most user friendly desktop distro I've used.
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