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2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

justingarrison.com

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Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#81

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

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Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#82

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

I’ve been running desktop Linux since the 90s, and it’s been my primary desktop since XP was first released (XP was what drove my to Linux) and I can count on one hand the number of times I’ve needed to write a shell script to fix basic functionality.

I’m not taking anything away from your experiences though. Just offering another data point.

I do get the appeal of macOS. I use it for work but I honestly find it more frustrating than pleasurable but that’s purely because I don’t always agree with Apples design choices.

…And that is the real problem with macOS for me. If you like their default experience then it’s a much more pleasurable platform to use. But if there’s any significant part of Apples design choices you don’t get alone with, then you’re often shit out of luck. Trying to bend macOS to behave any way outside of Apples vision can be more frustrating than dealing with Linux quirks.

That all said, I am in love with the battery life on the ARM MacBook Pros. I’ve managed to go a full working day without plugging the MBP in. There isn’t any comparative device out there for Linux.

So in the end I find Linux for personal devices and macOS for work is a great compromise for me.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#83

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

I have the same feelings about OSX, though. It's probably a result of familiarity more than anything else.

Take mouse speed, for example. I remember this being incredibly difficult in OSX: https://www.reddit.com/r/macgaming/comments/7bg3gg/removing_...

On linux it's just a menu option in a gui, or a single command.

Every platform has plenty of bugs, but I find it is consistently easier to figure out how to change/fix things on Linux than on OSX or Windows. OSX is probably the worst platform as soon as you're doing something Apple didn't anticipate (or, is actively blocking you from doing).

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#84

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

My experience is similar. Anything more complicated than the basic stuff like surfing the web is hard.

Things are getting better in the Linux desktop, but in a slow pace. I had some hope with the PopOs (I don't know what they are doing nowadays).

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#85

If I'm honest, Linux is...exhausting. I'm technically proficient, but even the "user-friendly" Ubuntu is a pain to work with. Something as simple as changing the mouse scroll speed requires creating a bash script. Software updates rarely work. There are random crashes that take hours to fix. I'm about to give in the towel and get a Mac. I can get it to work because the terminal doesn't scare me, but there's no way I…

There's no singular 'linux experience', all the problems you list are expected problems with some software on linux, but work just fine with other software systems on linux. Unfortunately many of the defaults chosen by Ubuntu are very poor and give bad first impressions. I think that recommending Ubuntu is an anachronism from the mid to late 00s. Experience makes it all much easier, simply because you learn which sof…

> I think that recommending Ubuntu is an anachronism from the mid to late 00s.

What would you recommend as a modern-day user-friendly Linux experience? I've been looking for something not too demanding to put on an old X220.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#86

Is there any Linux distribution with MacOS levels of reliability, simplicity, and productivity, that can reliably be updated without the boot partition getting full, random things like thunderbolt docks not working, or sleep states being faulty (or the machine not working properly after waking from sleep), or external monitor resolutions being wrong, and monitor scaling working properly when you have two monitors wit…

Your description of macOS's and MacBooks' reliability doesn't match my experience. I've been using MacBook Pros for about 15 years now, and every single one that I've ever owned or used long-term has always had some kind of bizarre issue that ended up forcing me to replace it.

It's actually funny that you mention issues with Thunderbolt docks and monitors, because I feel like those were some of the most frequent issues I've encountered. This year, I actually swapped my work MacBook Pro for a Linux laptop specifically because my Mac would completely and irrecoverably lock up every time I tried docking it to two 4K monitors. My new Linux laptop has some issues of its own, but nothing that severe, at least.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#87
post #57
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sleep states are faulty on the Linux laptop I'm currently on, and I do occasionally waste time on interoperability with various commercial software, although countless hours seems excessive. But when it comes to running dev software or getting up and running with a new project, or compiling some github source, I think I save much more time than I've lost.

What frustrates me is that other Linux users will tell you with a straight face that you must be flat-out lying if you bring up sleep problems. Had three users tell me that on HN just about a day ago.

You must be lying! Are you implying S0x works badly and wakes too many times, pcie_aspm requires to be set to force to have decent results and enabling S3 is hidden somewhere in the BIOS assuming it's there at all?

You must be lying, I never heard of such stories!

NOTE: My computer came without OS. Assuming HP Dev One or System 76 behave better in this regard. But I'm a sucker for 2-in-1.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#89

Is there any Linux distribution with MacOS levels of reliability, simplicity, and productivity, that can reliably be updated without the boot partition getting full, random things like thunderbolt docks not working, or sleep states being faulty (or the machine not working properly after waking from sleep), or external monitor resolutions being wrong, and monitor scaling working properly when you have two monitors wit…

> that can reliably be updated without the boot partition getting full

Funny you say that. I can't boot into my dual Windows-arch desktop atm. systemd-boot is broken after I tried to set up XBOOTLDR partition, which I only had to do since the default Windows EFI partition didn't have space after an update.

1h20m to backup the 500GB SSD. I had to restore it once already after a botched shrinking of a Windows data partition. There was also a problem where literally nothing would boot - not even a USB. I believe this happened because I accidentally copied my main SSD (with the arch/windows EFI partition at the front) to the 8GB USB drive, and (again, speculating) having two similar drives confused the BIOS enough that nothing would boot, it just kept defaulting to network boot. "(Drive not present)" on the Windows/arch boot options. Sigh...

Anyways, I still need to try adding/removing a timeout for the systemd-boot config. I've already tried hosting everything on a separate, larger EFI partition. When I boot to Linux from the BIOS it just shows me options for Windows 10 and back to boot.

TL;DR Linux is a huge PITA.

Re: 2022 was the year of Linux on the Desktop?

#90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bugs? sounds like they misconfigured their OS Linux is not a commercial product that'll suit everyone all at once, you need to learn about its components, linux is just a kernel If your argumentation is "various linux bugs", then you should stick to Windows, it has nice "various windows bugs", or macos, it has nice "various macos bugs" There must be a reason why linux empowers the world from micro controllers to data…

No FUD. On laptops I’ve repeatedly failed to get the correct battery life. I’ve also struggled with audio working correctly and reliably. Sure, something might be misconfigured but the universe of misconfiguration for a Mac and Linux are substantially different because Linux is a much sharper tool. Pointing the finger at the user is emblematic of the problems Linux has when people say it isn’t suitable for the deskto…

> On laptops I’ve repeatedly failed to get the correct battery life

You have to configure for it https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Power_management

Linux doesn't know nor care about what machine you use, it could be a microcontroller without battery to a datacenter to a laptop to a console, configure for what you use, it's not "windows for Intel PCs, RISC? what is that? fuck off"

> I’ve also struggled with audio working correctly and reliably.

That is very hard to believe, my bluetooth headset worked out of the box

> with the exception of steam deck and switch that have a carefully tuned and tightly controlled OS distribution for a carefully chosen hw configuration

That exactly prove my point, users usually misconfigured their OS, the moment you configure your Linux OS, just like Valve did, with your distro of choice to suit your HW, then everything works as expected, that's a one time job

If that workflow doesn't suit you, then linux is not for you, and that's ok

> Pointing the finger at the user is emblematic of the problems Linux has when people say it isn’t suitable for the desktop (and these days they mean laptop).

Because that's the reality of it, the problem is the user who expect things to work for him while ignoring its dimensional capabilities

That's not a linux problem, that's a user problem, it's arrogant and selfish to expect "Linux" to work just for your specific HW and specific usecase and all of the effort should be dedicated to you, just you, for your own sake

Do like valve did with steam deck and configure your Linux OS for your HW, if you are not ready for that, then use windows or macos

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