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O Holy Crap

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Re: O Holy Crap

#271

Post by ddejohn »

hoosieree wrote: post #3

Part of the reason we equate "old" with "good" like that 70 year old juicer is survivor bias. We don't dig through the landfill to find out how many broken 70 year old juicers are buried there. That said, I suspect that in another 70 years, Walter's juicer will still work, but you won't find any working examples of juicers from 2022. It should be obvious to most people at this point that any appliance with the word "…

Isn't there something to be said for the volume of anecdotal evidence of older appliances of higher quality? Like, is it really survivor bias if older appliances have a (perceived) significantly higher probability of lasting? Sure, some items may not have lasted, some may be flukes, but if you compare the relative quantities of "older appliances still working" vs "new appliances still working", the proportion of older appliances to the total from "that era" is likely much higher than now.

I have no evidence to back my statements up, and I'm using extremely vague language, but this is at least my perception of this idea that "they don't make 'em like they used to."

Re: O Holy Crap

#272

Post by thewebcount »

bombcar wrote: post #242
MarkusWandel wrote: post #241

Some things have gotten better, some worse. Current car is at 202,000km and 11 years and essentially nothing has gone wrong with it except normal wear and tear replacement and it isn't even (in this road salt envioronment) noticeably rusty and it's never even had a spark plug out. Try that even 30 years ago. On the other hand, motorized kitchen appliances really seem to be designed to be about 0.0001% better than the…

Speed Queen on the washer will last awhile and parts are plentiful when they do wear out. You can replace the fridge door seal pretty easily, too.

Speed Queen washers are all tiny, though. Our current LG (a company I despise, but had the highest CR rating by far), is something like 5 cubic feet. The Speed Queens were all in the 3 cubic feet range. Depending on family size, amount of bedding, etc., something that small can be a real pain to deal with.

Re: O Holy Crap

#273

Post by eternityforest »

bumby wrote: post #216
eternityforest wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True embedded software is a lot different. Smart TVs are desktop or phone class computers, and even then, the glitches are usually "A power cycle fixes it" or "One feature that wouldn't exist at all without software stops working" type of thing. For non safety critical stuff it's much better to crash every week than to wear out in 5 years.

> glitches are usually "A power cycle fixes it" Maybe I'm becoming a curmudgeon or maybe it's my bias as a former reliability engineer, but the fact that we've normalized this drives me crazy. Imagine your frustration if your car needed to be "power cycled" on a regular basis just to keep it moving forward, yet we've become accustomed to that in our day-to-day interactions with electronics. It's the bane of my existe…

It's definitely not ideal, and I obviously try to do better than that in any product I work on.

But I've seen so many things fail due to bad switches, connectors, and other simple parts, to me it's a great tradeoff to occasionally reboot something as opposed to having it totally fail at some random time within a few years.

I wouldn't trust my life to it, but I'll trust my watch party to it.

Plus, a consumer now only needs to power cycle or factory reboot, so untrained people can keep stuff going.

I'd much rather they need reboots than need skilled work like they used to, that just wouldn't be practical in a digital first world.

Oddly enough having failures be so normalized makes them less problematic, because the victim doesn't get many complaints. People who have to wait just assume that's how it is, nobody will tell you you shouldn't have used a computer for that

Before all these complex systems we used pen and paper and things subject to human error, and we had to deal with that quite a bit.

Computers suck compared to what they could be but they are amazing compared to a lot of older stuff.

Re: O Holy Crap

#274

Post by bsder »

starkd wrote: post #113
wonderwonder wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ordered a pair of buffalo jeans the other day and they arrived missing a belt loop on the front. Pretty frustrating as I've ordered jeans from this company without issues before this. I generally only have 2 pairs of jeans on hand at any time so my go to brand shipping flawed jeans was a bummer.

Maybe its time more people learn how to sew.

Sewing denim, leather, canvas, etc. is generally a pain in the ass. Even old consumer grade machines would have a tough time. You either needed an industrial machine or an old-school treadle machine that you could overpower.

What I want is someone that I can pay to sew stuff for me and have it not suck.

The problem is that someone who does that is continually having to hunt down new clients since their stuff doesn't fall apart. And they can't charge enough because the crappy stuff is soooo cheap that it sets the floor of the pricing.

If we want artisans to make a comeback, we're going to have to help them somehow.

Re: O Holy Crap

#275

Post by thewebcount »

blep_ wrote: post #263
cfeduke wrote: post #42

The thing in this space that has always bothered me was the simple can opener. (For those not in the US, yes, in the US we still need can openers.) The new ones which can be purchased in the grocery store break within a month or two. I don't even want to think about modern electric openers. I found a used vintage can opener from the 1970s on eBay six years ago and use it practically every day; as it was used it cost…

... do people outside the US not use can openers?

Who knows. The responses people in the US get from Europeans on HN for things are just the absolute oddest. “Gasp! You still write checks?” Or “Gasp! You use credit cards? Well I never!” I’m sure we do the same thing to them for other stuff, but I totally understand the desire to head off any of the faux outrage that often pops up here for such mundane things.

Re: O Holy Crap

#276

Post by mauvehaus »

cfeduke wrote: post #42

The thing in this space that has always bothered me was the simple can opener. (For those not in the US, yes, in the US we still need can openers.) The new ones which can be purchased in the grocery store break within a month or two. I don't even want to think about modern electric openers. I found a used vintage can opener from the 1970s on eBay six years ago and use it practically every day; as it was used it cost…

You want a swing-a-way can opener. They make them like they used to.

Re: O Holy Crap

#277

Post by blep_ »

thewebcount wrote: post #275
blep_ wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... do people outside the US not use can openers?

Who knows. The responses people in the US get from Europeans on HN for things are just the absolute oddest. “ Gasp! You still write checks?” Or “ Gasp! You use credit cards? Well I never!” I’m sure we do the same thing to them for other stuff, but I totally understand the desire to head off any of the faux outrage that often pops up here for such mundane things.

I was totally expecting the answer to be something like "the EU passed a law in 2013 requiring all cans to come with pull tabs".

Re: O Holy Crap

#278

Post by mauvehaus »

phaedrus wrote: post #259

Regarding the short cords on appliances, my mother (retired) has actually taken the time to call up at least one appliance manufacturer and give them an earful about kitchen appliances whose cords don't reach. The manufacturer had the gall to try to tell her this is "what consumers want" and they're saving her the favor of having a cord that could tangle or be dangerous. So her kitchen features appliances plugged int…

Modern code actually requires an absurd number of receptacles in kitchens with the express purpose of not requiring extension cords because using an undersized cord is a fire hazard.

Unfortunately, appliance manufacturers haven't quite caught on to the fact that kitchen last rather longer than appliances, and so there are a great many kitchens without a ridiculous number of outlets that are home to appliances with too-short cords plugged into extension cords.

Re: O Holy Crap

#279

Post by collinvandyck76 »

jemmyw wrote: post #249
collinvandyck76 wrote: post #38

Under the Christmas tree this year: another Cuisinart electric kettle. Same model as always, this year recommended by wirecutter. They last two to three years and then break in various ways. This is our third one :( My dad gave me the advice "buy cheap now and be guaranteed to buy it again at least once if not more, or wait, save up, and buy the more expensive thing only once" as I was becoming an adult. I've tried t…

Why do you keep buying the same one?

Because we really like it, otherwise.

Re: O Holy Crap

#280

Post by ejb999 »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #202
ejb999 wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

baloney - what is the cost to the environment of producing, transporting and then throwing away a refrigerator every 7-10 years? How about the gas used for the service calls? My old fridge is running perfectly, and costs me less than $10-$15/month. A typical modestly price refrigerator these days cost $1000 at home depot (and easily more) - even if I could cut electricity by 50%, saving 7.50 a month in electric, a ty…

70 years old? Really?

yes, amazingly it really is - built in the early 1950's and still works perfectly. Not pretty enough to keep in the house anymore, but still hums away day after day. They truly don't make them like they used to.
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