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Bullshit

marco.org

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Re: Bullshit

#71

Post by conradfr »

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #64
bru wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does Google have a look at Google Analytics? I thought it was only for the webmasters who set it up and that Google did not touch it. It is nearly their only service that I haven't blocked (with the libraries available on their CDN).

Here's what Google says about analytics: Website owners that use Google Analytics have control over what data they allow Google to use. They can decide if they want Google to use this data or not by using the Google Analytics Data Sharing Options. When these options allow, the data is used to improve Google products and services. Website owners can change these options at anytime. http://www.google.com/intl/en/analyt…

Your link has this : http://tools.google.com/dlpage/gaoptout?hl=en

Re: Bullshit

#72

Post by nl »

padolsey wrote: post #58
nl wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now that is Bullshit. Yes, Google makes money from their advertising. But Google does things that directly limit their ability to make money from advertising, when those decisons are in the interest of consumers. Take the whole design and UX of Chrome. There are many, many ways Google could have changed the design to make more money from it, and yet they haven't because they aren't in the interests of the users. Addi…

Also, could you provide an example of where advertising improves the user experience?

Netflix and Amazon recommendation systems.

Re: Bullshit

#73

Post by nl »

vl wrote: post #62
redditmigrant wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is this bullshit? >"We expect all our businesses to have a positive impact on our top and bottom lines. Profitability is very important to us or we wouldn't be in this business. " If anything thats being upfront that Amazon is a business in the business of making money.

Probably parent implied that many AWS services are run at zero margin or at loss to block competition from entering.

Given that you can get anything AWS does cheaper elsewhere I don't think argue that.

AWS's advantages are many, but price isn't really a critical one.

Re: Bullshit

#74

Post by fauigerzigerk »

jacoblyles wrote: post #15

When I think of something being "bullshit", I think it is totally false. But many of these points are part-truths, not complete falsehoods. For example, Google tracks lots of personal data to make their products better. So the sentence "We solicit all of your personal information and track everything you do to make things better for you" is partially true. Of course, something is in it for Google too. When they add n…

Google collects personal data to make their advertising product better for advertisers. Translating that into something along the lines of "we track you to make the product better for you" is misleading to a degree that it deserves to be called bullshit.

Obviously, there are indirect benefits to users from advertising. It's what funds the service after all. But there is a balance, and tracking has made the product worse for me to the point where I have stopped using it.

Re: Bullshit

#75

Post by riffraff »

jrockway wrote: post #38
riffraff wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but it is just too damn easy to switch search engines. and personal email, and collaboration tools, and project mailing lists, and photo service, and maps service, and video hosting.. If you consider google as the search engine maybe not, but if you consider google the company the it's downright scary how hard it would be to get out of their grasp, IMO.

I don't think it would be that hard. You're one MX record change away from changing your mailhost without anyone ever knowing. You can continue using your gmail.com address without ever seeing ads by connecting with IMAP. You can get maps from anywhere, including Open Street Map. You can move your photos from Picassa to your own machine and to Flickr, if you desire. Google Chat is XMPP, so you can get a new "chat pro…

I believe you are arguing against something I didn't posit. Google certainly has a lecit business and has gained success because of good products, and it's easy to "liberate" a lot of data.

My point was that while changing search engine is easy:

* migrating all your data is way harder

* opting out of some google online services (e.g. maps) does not free me from third parties relying on them (e.g. android, iphone)

* I can't change the habits of the rest of the world, so I'm stuck with them if I want to join ai-class.org, read something on blogger or peruse a project mailing list on groups.

* the fact that the services are good _is_ a lockin, as it makes it harder to get off of them

Just this. Changing search engine is easy, opting out of google's products is, at least for me, much much harder.

I love google the company and their products, it just seems nearly impossible to get out of their reach without resorting to RMS-style "I email myself web pages I want to read" estremisms.

Re: Bullshit

#76

Post by fauigerzigerk »

conradfr wrote: post #71
fauigerzigerk wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's what Google says about analytics: Website owners that use Google Analytics have control over what data they allow Google to use. They can decide if they want Google to use this data or not by using the Google Analytics Data Sharing Options. When these options allow, the data is used to improve Google products and services. Website owners can change these options at anytime. http://www.google.com/intl/en/analyt…

Your link has this : http://tools.google.com/dlpage/gaoptout?hl=en

Am I supposed to install an opt-out plugin for every single tracking service in the world? There are hundereds of those, and asking each of them to voluntarily stop tracking me makes no sense.

Re: Bullshit

#77

Post by Hari_Seldon »

alpb wrote: post #29

Just wondering, why are we valuing this blog post that talks about a first world problem and brings no solution or anything critic or productive? Are we biased against Marco.org?

I'm confused, what is wrong with talking about a first world problem? and what do you mean by "Are we biased against Marco.org"?

Re: Bullshit

#78

Post by nirvdrum »

vacri wrote: post #61

Devoid of anything new or insightful, this article sounds like a teen being 'edgy'.

My thoughts exactly. It feels like upvotes for the author, not the content.

Re: Bullshit

#79

Post by rfergie »

Pheter wrote: post #65
potatolicious wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What yeswecan said, but to expand: people like brands - they will gladly and openly declare their brand allegiances on their profiles. We saw this before Pages even came out. What people don't want to do is to be constantly bombarded by bullshit communications from said brands. In many ways, openly declaring your brand preferences is signaling - the "liking" of brands is for their friends , not an enthusiastic wish t…

But it works, which is why they do it.

I work with some brands on trying to measure this and in many cases I'm not sure it does work.

The typical process works like this:

1. Brand creates facebook page

2. People who really, really love the brand connect with the page.

3. The brand observes that people who have connected with them on social media are excellent customers.

4. The brand tries to increase the number of connected users by offering promotions and similar.

5. The new connections do not have the same value as the originals because they are attracted only by the offers and promotions. Which the brand then needs to keep offering otherwise "engagement" and other similar metrics drop off.

6. The original connections, the brands best and most enthusiastic customers, are now trained to only purchase when a discount is offered. Margins suffer all round.

It can appear that social media offers an easy way to create revenue. The long term effects are much harder to measure (because there is a huge lag between action and measurement) but they are often negative.

Re: Bullshit

#80

Post by adabsurdo »

arctangent wrote: post #33

> Facebook: "Our users want to interact with brands." As distasteful as the hacker crowd may find it, this is probably a true statement. A significant number of people (in the developed world) really do construct a large part of their personal identity by buying branded products from companies in order to signal something about themselves. There's a section on this on the Wikipedia page for "Brand": http://en.wikiped…

kind of ironic to say hackers are above branding, when here we are arguing Apple vs Google vs Facebook!
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