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Atom was archived today

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531–540 of 614 posts

Re: Atom was archived today

#531

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I second that, Sublime raised the bar and set the new standard, the only advantage VScode now has over sublime is it's open source license.

... and the fact that I don't have to pay for it. Never understood why anyone would spend money on a text editor.

It's a tool most of us use for many thousands of hours a year. Buying a better one, even if it was only a bit easier to use, or a bit faster, makes a lot of sense.

Also, many developers (not all) make a lot of money. Even Sublime's steep 60 bucks, which when I discovered Sublime as a student was crazy to me, is reasonable when compared to our salaries.

I don't think anyone would be surprised if a woodworker said "Yeah my drill works fine but I'm going to spend 60 bucks on a slighly better one; I use it a lot and mine's ergonomics aren't great."

Re: Atom was archived today

#532

It might sound controversial, but for me Atom was almost a 1 to 1 Sublime copy with worse performance and quality. It was slow and ugly. It’s only quality was that it was 0$. It was the first editor I’ve seen to choke when opening 1M file (it even had a warning that it’s a too big file - lol). There simply was not enough RAM in the world for this memory hog. I’m not really sad to see it go. It was another free toy of…

> t was the first editor I’ve seen to choke when opening 1M file I recall trying Atom before VSCode had been released. I loaded up a 1MB XML file and it ground to a halt. After some searching I found a bug tracker issue reflecting this, where one of the devs said something to the effect of "a 1MB XML file is extremely large, I don't think we'll support that". At that point I uninstalled Atom. On a related note, not l…

2.5G is definitely excessive.

Re: Atom was archived today

#533

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it has to have something beyond price if it's taking by storm the editor arena that always has had great editors. I think it has gained its place in the eternal emacs vs vim discussion, and that's a feat to be reckoned. In 15 years there will be other fancier editors but VS Code will still be there.

VS Code is good, but not THAT good. It has unparalleled remote editing with the SSH extension, but the actual editor is beaten by Sublime. I can buy that people like it, I don’t dislike it, but it also isn’t sliced bread. There’s peers in the market that are ahead in various ways, so VS Code isn’t the end all be all, even if it is cool.

Is the remote editing better than emacs?

Re: Atom was archived today

#534
post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vim and Emacs are free. This seems like the norm to me.

Yes, and when was the last time a large room of new developers told you how amazed they were at how great Emacs was? How easy it was to setup vim plugins? How seemless the experience was between Mac and windows and Linux? Literally never would be my answer. People like vscode because of the time and effort that has been spent making it friendly and approachable, yet still powerful. Those are not just things that magi…

> Yes, and when was the last time a large room of new developers told you how amazed they were at how great Emacs was? How easy it was to setup vim plugins? How seemless the experience was between Mac and windows and Linux?

This seems like a reflection of your environment. This has happened to me more than once with both Vim and Emacs (and not just at a Vim conference:-D). The environment at the time one was a C++ shop, another was a Ruby conference. For example people were amazed when they heard about how you can call vim APIs with Ruby!

Re: Atom was archived today

#535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and when was the last time a large room of new developers told you how amazed they were at how great Emacs was? How easy it was to setup vim plugins? How seemless the experience was between Mac and windows and Linux? Literally never would be my answer. People like vscode because of the time and effort that has been spent making it friendly and approachable, yet still powerful. Those are not just things that magi…

> How seemless the experience was between Mac and windows and Linux? It's pretty damn seamless with Vim. I code on a Mac these days, but was using Windows (w/ WSL) and Ubuntu about 50/50 before that. The same Vim (neovim) config script followed me everywhere.

Agreed. Vim was probably the most seamless of any software. If all I could see was the vim window, I wouldn't be able to say whether it was running on Linux or Mac. I don't think it gets any better than that.

Re: Atom was archived today

#536

https://old.reddit.com/r/AMA/comments/8pc8mf/im_nat_friedman... > I’m Nat Friedman, future CEO of GitHub. AMA. > Atom is a fantastic editor with a healthy community, adoring fans, excellent design, and a promising foray into real-time collaboration. At Microsoft, we already use every editor from Atom to VS Code to Sublime to Vim, and we want developers to use any editor they prefer with GitHub. > So we will continue…

I was at MS more than a decade ago, and I can attest that nobody cared what editor you used and there were people using everything.

Of course there were many problems at MS, but lack of religiosity about text editors was a bright point of their culture.

Re: Atom was archived today

#537
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VSCode is one of the greatest pieces of engineering of our time. It's really only when you compare it with Atom that you realize how great it is. Atom was built by incredibly smart people, who had full control over the platform and several years of head start, and they were still out-engineered by the VSCode team at every turn. VSCode did almost everything right: The choice of TypeScript as the base language (with wh…

VSCode is good but as someone who’s been writing software for nearly 40 years, I really feel you’ve over doing the compliments by a long long way. Compilers, operating systems, browser engines (unfortunately) and reverse engineering proprietary hardware/firmware are all significantly harder challenges than writing an IDE. in fact there have been excellent IDEs around for decades before VSCode came along. Yes the indu…

> In fact there have been excellent IDEs around for decades before VSCode came along.

I wonder what everyone's favorite IDE is. I don't think I could put my finger on a single one and claim that it's the best.

I really liked Lazarus (for Pascal), because it's perhaps one of the snappiest tools I've used for a language that also compiles pretty fast. Though it's certainly not as modern or smart as JetBrains products.

I rather liked NetBeans (for Java and PHP), because it's truly free and can be relatively lightweight. The interface doesn't feel overbearing either, you get some framework/library support out of the box and even projects like jMonkeyEngine built upon NetBeans for their game engine editor. It's like libre JetBrains lite, but struggles with larger projects.

I rather liked MonoDevelop (for C#), because it felt like the .NET equivalent of NetBeans, was lightweight, functional and just worked without getting too much into your way. That said, it never really got as much attention as other products in the space (Visual Studio or JetBrains Rider).

I acknowledge the success of Eclipse (for Java and other languages), because I've seen that platform be used for anything from being an IDE for programming, to niche modeling tools and graphical programs. Some also swear by its incremental compiler (for Java), but personally it feels sluggish to me (like running JetBrains IDEs with low RAM) and its stability is inversely proportional to how many plugins you have.

I acknowledge the success of Visual Studio (for .NET and other languages), because when your platform is a walled garden, you can make sure that the experience is focued on doing things within it decently (like XCode, I guess), even though sometimes the IDE felt similarly heavy to JetBrains offerings and was more opinionated towards what you can do with it, as well as the platform support.

I like JetBrains IDEs (IntelliJ and their other offerings), because they have perhaps the best autocomplete and code refactoring/inspection tools out of any other solution out there. The plugin ecosystem is rich, the language support is pretty great, the experience across various languages is similar enough. Though the obvious downsides are large system requirements (you need enough RAM and project indexing is slow, having 6 Java projects open and 2 front end projects open is a pain), bad run configurations (that making sharing run configurations across Windows/Linux really hard because of interpreter selection for scripts etc.) and confusing menus (due to how much functionality there is, a bit like Visual Studio, though the menu structure changes for different IDEs from them as well). The benefits still outweigh the negatives and so I pay for all their tools.

I like Visual Studio Code as a text editor (for anything really), but it feels like some of the refactoring and code editing support is lacking, especially when working with enterprise codebases. You can get pretty close to a fully fledged IDE with it, but at that point you're also trading some of the performance and lighter footprint away. Regardless, most of my projects have a .workspace file in them and I use Visual Studio Code together with JetBrains products.

I like other attempts at feature filled text editors as well, be it Fleet (though was a bit too unfinished last I tried their preview), CudaText (really interesting project with lots of nice features) or anything else, really.

At the end of the day, there is no single best IDE, just different ones that are suited for different tasks.

Edit: actually decided not to include the nano vs vi/vim discussion, since that's not super relevant to the discussion. Either is fine, I like the simplicity of nano more.

Re: Atom was archived today

#538

Very sad. I'll continue to use it. I can't abide how vscode is run as a project by Microsoft.

What's wrong with how Microsoft runs the VS Code project?

If you spend time in their issues, or try to contribute via issues, a pattern emerges; Microsoft as a corp entity has an iron grip on the development and progress. It's open source only in that you can fork freely. UX and DX improvements are routinely shut down by MS employees, MS employees have a deep, deep sense of ownership and tend to respond defensively, repo maintainers are exclusively MS employees (I'm welcome to be wrong here, I couldn't find any that weren't), platitudes are common responses to issues for legitimate improvement, any comparison to Atom or any other editor is summarily shut down after "good faith" discussion, and development and improvements are beholden to the Microsoft development and release cycle.

Now I'll admit I'm fairly cynical wrt VS Code and have a negative view of the team that runs and owns VS Code, and by extension VS Code itself as a product due to the myriad of Microsoft-esc UX and DX forced upon the user. There's a great product in there but Microsoft is a horrible steward.

Re: Atom was archived today

#539
post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"VSCode is the greatest productivity tool in the history of software engineering" in a world where vi and emacs exist seems like a bit of an exaggeration, and I'm not even a fan of either (VS Code is my daily driver; I like my GUI editors and I like them to behave like normal apps on the platform I'm running).

Vim and Emacs cannot compare to VSCode when it comes to productivity. With VSCode, you type the name of any programming language in the extension search, click "Install", and you have a world-class development environment for that language ready to go. This is light years ahead of the traditional editors, and saves many hours of time. Not to mention that VSCode has countless other productivity boosters built in which…

emacs packages is basically the same UX, tho perhaps there are more packages a given person might want for a language. really most packages don't need much config for base functionality.

Re: Atom was archived today

#540
post #75
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Atom predated the LSP and leaned heavily into customizations with all the plugins running inside the UI thread (more like a traditional web page and 3p scripts). At the time they viewed the extreme customization support as a feature, and there was a thriving ecosystem of folks making plugins. That architecture has a major flaw though. A default install was fast, but a real configuration with all the plugins ended up…

VSCode is one of the greatest pieces of engineering of our time. It's really only when you compare it with Atom that you realize how great it is. Atom was built by incredibly smart people, who had full control over the platform and several years of head start, and they were still out-engineered by the VSCode team at every turn. VSCode did almost everything right: The choice of TypeScript as the base language (with wh…

> VSCode is the greatest productivity tool in the history of software engineering

LOL. Do you work for MS? This is a bit thick, even for hyperbole. Personally I find IntelliJ to be superior to VS Code.

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