Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

link.springer.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

591–600 of 662 posts

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#591

Post by mint2 »

SnowProblem wrote: post #502
sdnas211 wrote: post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is showing the raw numbers - they aren't adjusted for vaccinated/unvaccinated population sizes. ~53 million people have had at least one shot, and there are around 6 million children under 10 (so not counted in the figures you linked). With a population of about 68 million total, the unvaccinated all causes figures should be about 16% of the ever vaccinated. The ratio should skew further in older age ranges, as…

It also shows mortality rates per 100,000. That's what I was referring to. For example, here are the rates of all-cause mortality for the most last month they released, May 2022, for the 40-49 group: - Unvaccinated: 64.1 - One dose: 171.5 - Two doses: 106.4 - Three doses: 83.7

Lest someone draw the statistically unsound but temping surface level conclusion from this, consider that people with pre-existing conditions and especially severe ones would have more incentive to have three doses. There is self selection on these groups, they are not random samples.

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#592

Post by mint2 »

adamiscool8 wrote: post #196
librish wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What constitutes a 'serious adverse event' in this data? Do you mind linking the source? Having a 1 in 3000 chance of getting so sick you need to be hospitalized seems quite bad.

The true hospitalization risk from COVID could be 1/4th to 1/10th that given that cases are widely estimated to be 4-10X what was reported. The serious adverse event definition and rates are defined here: https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/vaccine-safety/ut... 1 in 9000 doses reportedly results in a SAE, so if you are mandated to take 4 doses, your risk becomes ~0.04% or ~1/2500. This also does not factor in…

> 1 in 9000 doses reportedly results in a SAE, so if you are mandated to take 4 doses, your risk becomes ~0.04% or ~1/2500.

That sounds like motivated bad assumptions.

Seems highly plausible that those who would get the reaction in the 1/9000 would select out the sensitive individuals so the rate would be less for subsequent shots on the other 8999. It seems very unlikely it will be a constant rate.

Anecdotally, I had the same reaction to all four shots. Mild symptoms the lasting 24 hours. With your comment’s assumption that’s pretty statistically unlikely, statistically it would have been likely that one would have been less or more, since by your comments logic it’s completely random.

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#593

Post by dehrmann »

nulld3v wrote: post #67

I am vaccinated but I am upvoting this post because I believe that it is important to investigate these cases to determine how to improve future vaccines. I really don't like how this topic seems to be treated like some fringe conspiracy theory. Maybe it is just a conspiracy, but we won't ever know until sufficient research has been done. Currently, I still believe that people should vaccinate, even if vaccines cause…

Another thing that hasn't gotten enough research is the effectiveness of the latest booster for someone who was vaccinated earlier and got omicron (this is a pretty big cohort). It's genuinely hard to make a recommendation one way or another on it because it's not clear how effective it is after four prior exposure events, and it has to be weighed against the risk of side effects like this.

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#594

Post by littlestymaar »

gfodor wrote: post #440
littlestymaar wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry to annoy you with the basics of public health policy. And the cost-benefit analysis being different for different age classes and comorbidity is exactly the reason why the vaccines was slowly expanded to larger demographics after starting with the most vulnerable people. In fact, the side effects of the vaccine have been much more thoroughly tracked than many pollutants that are routinely introduced in everybod…

I'm not part of any "guys", I'm not part of a tribe that you are imagining. I'm just someone who is vaccinated and thinks the mandates violate all traditional bioethical norms given what we have known for a while: the drug is experimental, under studied (no long term phase IV data), does not lead to herd immunity, has a novel mechanism, has a known serious side effect in 1 in 5k or so young men, and the risk of COVID…

> I'm not part of any "guys", I'm not part of a tribe that you are imagining.

Your comment history says otherwise.

> thinks the mandates violate all traditional bioethical norms

Mandatory vaccination has been the norm in many developed countries since at least the polio vaccine…

> there is a very real danger we are causing large scale subclinical heart damage to children by administering this drug so widely. In other words, it should not be mandatory.

But in what country is the vaccine mandatory for children again?

> and is being used to gloss over an immense amount of truly horrible stuff that happened during the vaccination campaign of 2021.

But you won't tell what this very «truly horrible stuff» is, will you? And what was the purpose of the conspiracy according to you? Big pharma making money? (why give vaccines then, when remdesivir is 3 orders of magnitude more expensive than the vaccine?) Or more fancy hypothesis like 5G tracking chips or masse sterilization of white population to replace them with immigrants?

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#595

Post by mint2 »

LarryMullins wrote: post #97
librish wrote: post #39

A question for vaccine skeptics: For it to be a reasonable choice to not want to take the vaccine wouldn't you need to balance the risk of death / complications from the vaccine against the risk of death / complications from covid multiplied by the risk of getting covid? There seems to be a lot of "aha I knew it" whenever any side-effect of the vaccine is found, but aren't the side-effects of covid well established,…

> For it to be a reasonable choice to not want to take the vaccine wouldn't you need to balance the risk of death / complications from the vaccine against the risk of death / complications from covid multiplied by the risk of getting covid? Reasonable is subjective. I got the covid vaccine and had no concern for side effects. But I, like most people, don't bother getting the flu shot every year and I think that's per…

Seat belts are a daily chore too?

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#596

Post by mint2 »

librish wrote: post #390
daneel_w wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every person I've asked (here in Sweden) who opted out of COVID-19 vaccination made their decision based on one year of case data covering the two first waves, which to them concluded that statistically they were at no risk based on their age and health status. Despite taking e.g. tetanus boosters, TBC vaccine etc., they are still being referred to as "antivaxxers".

At no risk for what?

Since I didn’t know Sweden was a nation entirely of stats experts, perhaps the poster meant no risk of objective, statistically sound analysis?

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#598

Post by blub »

gohigh54 wrote: post #534
blub wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The association between heart problems and mRNA vaccines is a settled matter - outside social media at least. The Paul Ehrlich institute which is monitoring vaccine side-effects has a nice detailed report on vaccine safety with details on heart problems and all sorts of other things. Most affected are men and male teens between 12-17 and Moderna’s causing more problems than Biontech. This was the main reason why the…

I missed “settled matter” in the scientific method handbook. The reality is that this experiment is still unfolding and will continue for the rest of my life. It will take decades of research and observations to have real answers. Settled matter? No.

In that sense nothing is ever a settled matter.

The same kind of technical gotcha like “there’s no evidence masks prevent infection”.

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#599

Post by burner990 »

threeseed wrote: post #104
burner990 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My employer wouldn't let me go to the office or even any offsites or outdoor actives (i.e. a picnic) until very recently. (Despite my approved religious exemption and "requiring" all employees to work in the office). If that isn't coercion to take an experimental vaccine i don't know what is.

a) I wouldn't class it as experimental when hundreds of millions of people have taken it. b) It sounds like your employer did the right thing to balance your rights versus those of the people you work with.

> I wouldn't class it as experimental when hundreds of millions of people have taken it.

that just means we're experimenting on hundreds of millions in real time. That was the whole point of the "emergency use".

> your rights versus those of the people you work with

no, employees don't have a legal "right" to work in a fully vaccinated office. That would imply that even if an employer wanted to give someone an exemption, then any employee could veto it.

Re: Autopsy-based characterization of myocarditis after anti-SARS-CoV-2-vaccination

#600

Post by dehrmann »

treeman79 wrote: post #321
nulld3v wrote: post #67

I am vaccinated but I am upvoting this post because I believe that it is important to investigate these cases to determine how to improve future vaccines. I really don't like how this topic seems to be treated like some fringe conspiracy theory. Maybe it is just a conspiracy, but we won't ever know until sufficient research has been done. Currently, I still believe that people should vaccinate, even if vaccines cause…

Wife got shot. Few days later her arm swelled up. 2 years later it still is. Her and I had already had Covid from before the vaccine. Absolutely refused to get it because of that. She now regrets it. She still gets Covid with every outbreak anyway. So doesn’t seem to have helped. I know a couple of kids that got it and have clots in their brains now. Less sure on timeline on these. But I’ve not seen this before. Sure…

> Few days later her arm swelled up. 2 years later it still is.

I am not a doctor, but that's weird. I almost wonder if it got infected. You had a doctor check it out, right?

Post reply on HN