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Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

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Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#441

Post by theteapot »

TehCorwiz wrote: post #350
hakanderyal wrote: post #96

Elon posted some info[0] that gives it some context: "Last night, car carrying lil X in LA was followed by crazy stalker (thinking it was me), who later blocked car from moving & climbed onto hood. Legal action is being taken against Sweeney & organizations who supported harm to my family." Make that what you will. [0]: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603190155107794944

The flight information that twitter account was using is publically available and required by law to BE public. https://www.vice.com/en/article/n7zygg/twitter-bans-elon-mus... "Sweeney has been using sites such as ADS-B Exchange to track the movements of private jets blogging to celebrities, tech billionaires, and Russian oligarchs for years now. By law, the movement of these plans is publicly available information.…

Later in same article:

> Musk has also apparently requested, via the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), that his plane not be tracked on third-party sites like FlightAware ... “This aircraft is on the the FAA blocklist meaning it is not allowed to be displayed to the general public,” a FlightAware spokesperson said in an email to Motherboard. “This is something that all 3rd party trackers do usually follow as a list is sent out every month."

Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#442

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

theteapot wrote: post #430
pgodzin wrote: post #310

Many people have been trying to get the point across that legal, unlimited free speech can put people in harm's way. Elon is happy to say that he's willing to trade harm to those people for his free speech principles, but as soon as his family is the one facing the repercussions, he's happy to change policy and sue.

Doxxing is not free speech. The sensible majority of people understand that. It's only a vocal small minority of idiots and troublemakers that argue otherwise.

From a legal perspective it definitely is in the US at least (unless it's pretty clear that you are calling for immanent action to be taken against the person you're doxing). Still a dick move, and probably illegal in a lot of other countries.

Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#445

Post by _JoRo »

ggm wrote: post #337
_JoRo wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious where people see Musk in terms of his politics. I see him as center/right-center (U.S) with the occasional right troll post. The part that I don't like about him taking over Twitter is this: When he initially took over I was under the impression that he wanted to promote a free-speech platform that is primarily designed for thoughtful dialogue between people. However, I'm not sure the platform will trend…

I used to believe his brand of libertarianism was an attempt at "neutral right" but the anti-union thing really strongly tilts right. He has since declared publicly he backs a GOP outcome. Given some of whats going on in the GOP that makes it very very hard to put him soft-right because a declaration of preference like that demands questions: what does he think about J6 and what does he think about vote suppression.…

My gut feeling (as a U.S resident) is that there has been a shift on both sides, but the overall country has moved more towards the left (so the shift on the right has maybe looked more extreme). I also think the overall media has become less trustworthy/more biased in their reporting so if you follow most western msm (which I believe is primarily left leaning) then even some right-center people can begin to look like strictly right (as I believe Elon is being made out to be).

My impression of Elon is that he just doesn't really like the left's 'holier than thou' political correctness (I don't think this meshes well with his corporate personality).

Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#446

Post by TehCorwiz »

theteapot wrote: post #441
TehCorwiz wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The flight information that twitter account was using is publically available and required by law to BE public. https://www.vice.com/en/article/n7zygg/twitter-bans-elon-mus... "Sweeney has been using sites such as ADS-B Exchange to track the movements of private jets blogging to celebrities, tech billionaires, and Russian oligarchs for years now. By law, the movement of these plans is publicly available information.…

Later in same article: > Musk has also apparently requested, via the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), that his plane not be tracked on third-party sites like FlightAware ... “This aircraft is on the the FAA blocklist meaning it is not allowed to be displayed to the general public,” a FlightAware spokesperson said in an email to Motherboard. “This is something that all 3rd party trackers do usually follow as a l…

Well, ADS-B Exchange still has his plane listed as you can see from the second link. So while that sounds like it could have been the case at one point, it does not seem to be the case right now.

Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#447

Post by kjksf »

TehCorwiz wrote: post #350
hakanderyal wrote: post #96

Elon posted some info[0] that gives it some context: "Last night, car carrying lil X in LA was followed by crazy stalker (thinking it was me), who later blocked car from moving & climbed onto hood. Legal action is being taken against Sweeney & organizations who supported harm to my family." Make that what you will. [0]: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603190155107794944

The flight information that twitter account was using is publically available and required by law to BE public. https://www.vice.com/en/article/n7zygg/twitter-bans-elon-mus... "Sweeney has been using sites such as ADS-B Exchange to track the movements of private jets blogging to celebrities, tech billionaires, and Russian oligarchs for years now. By law, the movement of these plans is publicly available information.…

https://twitter.com/scottwww/status/1490553502640140288

> Elon uses the FAA PIA privacy program for a private plane ID. When using a PIA address, the owner is anon and private, not public. Sweeney’s workaround is (likely) to spot a (rare) ICAO plane resembling Musk’s & noting the private code.

You can no longer claim it's public. It was de-anonymized in some way.

It's no longer a case of reposting public information but someone going considerable lengths to post this information.

The @ElonJet guy even bragged about it:

> Elon got PIA but I've already identified it!

Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#448

Post by donatj »

kentm wrote: post #407
donatj wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it comes down to tangible harm vs intangible theoretical harm. Anyone can claim intangible harm from anything. Doxing someone is a real tangible harm with very likely dangerous outcomes. Having an opinion is not.

If you consider doxing as a real tangible harm then what about vulnerable groups coming under harm due to being singled out? LibsOfTikTok made claims about Boston Children’s Hospital that caused tangible harm and yet they were unbanned. You might say that LibsOfTikTok didn’t cause the harm, that the responsibility was on the people perpetrating the bomb threats, but the same logic applies to ElonJet and this “stalker…

From my limited understanding of the whole LibsOfTikTok / Children's hospital thing, what they had posted was false and thus libel and thus illegal speech which is not allowed on the platform?

That seems unrelated.

Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#449

Post by TehCorwiz »

kjksf wrote: post #447
TehCorwiz wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The flight information that twitter account was using is publically available and required by law to BE public. https://www.vice.com/en/article/n7zygg/twitter-bans-elon-mus... "Sweeney has been using sites such as ADS-B Exchange to track the movements of private jets blogging to celebrities, tech billionaires, and Russian oligarchs for years now. By law, the movement of these plans is publicly available information.…

https://twitter.com/scottwww/status/1490553502640140288 > Elon uses the FAA PIA privacy program for a private plane ID. When using a PIA address, the owner is anon and private, not public. Sweeney’s workaround is (likely) to spot a (rare) ICAO plane resembling Musk’s & noting the private code. You can no longer claim it's public. It was de-anonymized in some way. It's no longer a case of reposting public information…

If you already know the plane's ID it doesn't matter if they redact the name and address after the fact.

Re: Twitter has re-suspended ElonJet account

#450

Post by ShredKazoo »

theteapot wrote: post #430
pgodzin wrote: post #310

Many people have been trying to get the point across that legal, unlimited free speech can put people in harm's way. Elon is happy to say that he's willing to trade harm to those people for his free speech principles, but as soon as his family is the one facing the repercussions, he's happy to change policy and sue.

Doxxing is not free speech. The sensible majority of people understand that. It's only a vocal small minority of idiots and troublemakers that argue otherwise.

My preferred operationalization of free speech is "minimum intimidation".

Slurs don't qualify for protection under this operationalization, because they intimidate the listener without providing any information content.

Same goes for protesting a talk so loudly that the speaker is drowned out, or doxxing.

If your speech serves only to intimidate others into silence, I don't think it should be protected.

Curious to hear everyone's objections to this high-level approach. (Note: I would want to add a bunch of clarifying details before making this Twitter's official policy, but it seems more interesting to provide those details in response to objections, instead of writing a long boring comment.)

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