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Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

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Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#201

Post by taternuts »

silisili wrote: post #194
DrBazza wrote: post #5

Sort-of-related, for Americans reading this, from a Brit, when I watch US TV programmes, the inclusion of drugs (prescription and illegal) in scripts is so matter-of-fact, it's actually shocking. Comparing like-for-like programs (police dramas, hospital dramas, thrillers), the UK version will invariably have entirely different plots. Sure the US != UK, but it's so weird. Isn't the USA the only country other than NZ t…

The TV advertising is really gross and annoying. And IMO, gotten much worse in recent years. I hadn't watched TV in years before I went to Southeast Asia. I always laughed that it seemed all the commercials were for coffee and beauty products, rarely anything else. Then I happened to catch live TV for the first time in a while after I returned, and realized it seemed 80% of the commercials were for random drugs. It m…

I recently went sober from alcohol and afterwards realized how much alcohol advertising there is, it's actually pretty insane. For certain programs (like football) it's almost %50 of the ads.

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#202

Post by vikasnair »

It’s important to note a significant percentage of these deaths are cases in which other substances with trace amounts of fentanyl are consumed unbeknownst to the user. Dealers often use the same scales, which is one risk factor for cross-contaminating supply.

My mother is a physician, she just last night told me about a case she saw over the weekend in which a young 20-something nearly OD’d on fentanyl from taking ecstasy. She survived, but with life-altering brain trauma rendering her unable to remember who she is. She needs tubes for her food supply, and a ventilator to breathe.

Here you can see a few images of what is a lethal dose of fentanyl: https://www.dea.gov/galleries/drug-images/fentanyl

Scary stuff, and maybe there’s an argument there to be made in favor of legalizing current black-market drugs. Definitely a PSA to test your drugs.

CDC on cross-contamination: https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/deaths/other-drugs.html

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#203

Post by tyingq »

2devnull wrote: post #200
tyingq wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not usually into conspiracy theories, but it has the flavor of "bury this without outright lying" .

You suspect the CDC would massage their messaging to manipulate (nudge?) public opinion towards achieving a desired outcome, rather than just straightforward factual scientific reporting the likes of which most people would expect?

Hard to speculate on motivation, but it's very odd that the information is arranged in a way that makes it very difficult to figure out "overdoses are the #1 killer of people aged 1-44".

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#204

Post by vorpalhex »

cies wrote: post #147
vorpalhex wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not supported by the research, marijuana use seems independent from opiod deaths (neither harming nor helping).

Hard line policing is the problem, not MJ/opiates itself. If you get in as much trouble doing/buying/selling/etc MJ as Fentanyl, you might as well do the latter. If MJ is legal, many would stick to that. Same for MJ-to-alcohol: and the alc producers know it, they lobbied fiercly against legal MJ and when it became legal (like in Canada) they were the first to invest heavily in it.

Why not just do alcohol then? It's much stronger than pot, legal and cheap.

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#205

Post by refurb »

thehappypm wrote: post #132
refurb wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a theory that seems correct - when a drug is banned, the black market moves towards the most potent version available. Even during prohibition it was way easier and profitable to make bootleg whiskey than beer. Why? It’s easier to conceal, packs the most punch, and is the most profitable by weight. Instead of making heroin legal, make opium legal. Or even weaker opioids like codeine. Then people who wanted a…

Marijuana seems to be an exception to this. After legalization it’s easier to get more and more and more concentrated versions

Good point, but it would be interesting to see how widely used they are?

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#206

Post by CharlesW »

slfnflctd wrote: post #63

Black market opiate & opioid users need to get off the danger train and start taking kratom. It may not get you quite as 'high', but it can stave off cravings and withdrawal symptoms, and help you find stability. Harm reduction is a viable solution.

Reputable sources seem to indicate that "nature's opioid" may be more of a sidegrade.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/consumer-health...

"In a study testing kratom as a treatment for symptoms of opioid withdrawal, people who took kratom for more than six months reported withdrawal symptoms similar to those that occur after opioid use. Too, people who use kratom may begin craving it and require treatments given for opioid addiction, such as naloxone (Narcan) and buprenorphine (Buprenex)."

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#207

Post by quantified »

alldayeveryday wrote: post #197
badpun wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Define significant part. There are people in 2020 living in absolutely abhorrent slums. Most major US cities have areas meeting this definition. The 1920 slums meant living at 5-10 people per room, with no running water, in constant stench from the nearby factories. I doubt you can find many places like that in US today. > Unsure if this is true. That's what the data I've found says - average time worked in non-agr…

So you seem to agree that 2020 and 1920 look very different, as far as the environment that people found themselves in. You seem to take issue with my claim that things have not improved for the better. Lets agree here instead that that some aspects of the environment are better and others are worse. Going back to the subject at hand (fentanyl use), I think one can safely state that more people are dying from drug ov…

What fraction of fentanyl deaths are by choice? The accidental OD's where it was unexpected are definitely not by choice. That's why fentanyl is being colored brightly, to help you see that something has been adulterated with it. Other drugs are being messed with by the middlemen, there is a supply chain problem.

Yes, less fentanyl in the supply chain would be the right answer.

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#208

Post by quantified »

bloopernova wrote: post #100
alldayeveryday wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I guess the point I'm poorly trying to make is that people aren't suddenly different to those in the 1970s, 1920s, or the 1800s. They have a similar environment with similar anxieties, pains, responsibilities, etc etc. Not in agreement on this. 2020 looks profoundly different than 1920, for example from the lens of western societies. People are more atomized, have less friends, are having less kids, are getting mar…

Conceding that point, you're right. People still look to escape the drudgery of their world, that doesn't change. You're right that we have far fewer social supports. Although I do wonder if a study would confirm that people with smaller in person social networks use or overuse drugs less than more isolated people.

Seems a lot like crack in the 80's but with a different mix of stigmas, and a lot more adulteration.

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#209

Post by [deleted] »

alldayeveryday wrote: post #197
badpun wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Define significant part. There are people in 2020 living in absolutely abhorrent slums. Most major US cities have areas meeting this definition. The 1920 slums meant living at 5-10 people per room, with no running water, in constant stench from the nearby factories. I doubt you can find many places like that in US today. > Unsure if this is true. That's what the data I've found says - average time worked in non-agr…

So you seem to agree that 2020 and 1920 look very different, as far as the environment that people found themselves in. You seem to take issue with my claim that things have not improved for the better. Lets agree here instead that that some aspects of the environment are better and others are worse. Going back to the subject at hand (fentanyl use), I think one can safely state that more people are dying from drug ov…

[deleted]

Re: Washington faltered as fentanyl gripped America

#210

Post by alephnerd »

rhaway84773 wrote: post #185
thepasswordis wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parts of San Francisco have implemented these exact policies and they have made the problems a LOT worse.

San Francisco has 0 safe usage sites. I think the U.S. overall has low single digits. And even those exist in an extremely dubious legal space, requiring the cops to turn a blind eye to their existence.

SF de facto did. I used to live a couple blocks away from one. That said, they are now being shut down due to Federal liability reasons [0]

[0] - https://missionlocal.org/2022/12/san-francisco-fentanyl-tend...

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