Be even more wary of high-status people who cannot afford to countersignal ;)
Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
361–370 of 651 posts
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#362Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes this is very well put, you really hit the nail on the head here on the sort of reverse bell curve of signaling.. For the very wealthy.. If you show enough interest in something to make signaling purchases, it's expected to be "up to snuff" .. this can mean very very high expense or high esotericness. So that might mean a $200k sports car, or it might mean some uncommon though inexpensive limited production vintag…
Very senior/wealthy people can get away with whatever they want. It's why Zuckerberg can look like a total slob at Facebook (notice he still wore a suit while testifying to Congress though). If a senior executive wore a $200 suit to work, nobody would say a word.
True, but they are more likely to wear a $400 hoodie than a $200 suit.
Outside SBF, even the executives dressing "casually" are still doing so expensively.
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#363Earlier quoted context omitted.
> * The last round of job searching doing zoom interviews, I wore my hoodie for half the calls. If I had done this while job searching out of college, during my internship, or at my first job.. I would not be where I am today.* That's not just status, it's got change over time mixed in.
It's partially status in that, I'm advanced enough in my career that I don't really care to work anywhere that would ding me in a zoom interview over my outfit. Earlier in my career I could not have afforded to be so picky. One of the starkest power dynamics in dress code I've observed is in non-tech firms that have large tech orgs to support the revenue generating roles. While there were official dress codes that te…
I’ve heard someone say a few months back that a zoom setup is the new business suit/attire. After spending the pandemic working from an unfinished/unheated garage near a loud expressway, I definitely felt there were situations where I was “dinged” for it at a FAANG company.
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#364> If a chimpanzee views a person perform a series of superfluous actions, along with one single necessary action, in order to obtain a piece of food, the chimpanzee will skip the superfluous action, and perform only the necessary one. > In contrast, children will copy every single action, including the unnecessary ones. I watched the video, but I'm unconvinced. They tell the kid the box is " magic ". Children know th…
>Children know the box is not magic.
are you sure about that?
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#365"An example from Ogilvy Vice Chairman Rory Sutherland: If you’re a top executive, turning up to work on a bicycle is a high-status activity because it was a choice and not a necessity. But if you work at Pizza Hut, turning up on a bike means you can’t afford a car." This tidbit reminds me of a similar anecdote (that my experience aligns with) re: the modern upper class that wearing a $2k Rolex or driving a $70k BMW i…
When I worked at Google I always had the distinct feeling that my hard work was paying for some manager’s $500k home renovation. I’m way more interested in working hard to help people who really need it, and I’m glad I’m not working at a place like that anymore.
Where did you end up that is helping people who really need it?
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#366Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which is a shame. Someone wearing business casual is so much more pleasant to the eye than typical sloppy hacker wear. Especially once you start getting older and flabbier.
These are also culturally dependent, and are in-group/out-group signals. Many people in Silicon Valley explicitly want to keep people who believe that business casual is more pleasing to the eye out of their social circles. It's a value judgment; to them, hoodies are more pleasing to the eye, and more comfortable, and they don't want people who believe otherwise in their companies.
Right, that's the point of the parent of this subthread. They (the hoodie-wearers) would probably insist that they don't judge based on dress or appearance, but they do, and maybe more harshly than the suit-wearers. It's just what people do. I grew up wearing suits to work, shaving every day, and wearing a short neat haircut. I don't as much anymore, but I don't wear hoodies with pizza sauce stains either, and I don't respect the people who do as much as the ones who look like they at least glanced in the mirror before they left the house.
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#367Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly. To me, a $500k unnecessary renovation throws more money away than a $70k vs $40k car. At least with the car you are likely getting safety features and extensive sensor suites for driver assist for the money, that have tangible impact on your driving experience. Or Spending 5-10x on a $10k appliance where a $1-2k one would do. These people tend to get the whole set, so it's a good $30-40k worth of kitchen app…
One slight different is that spending on your home will generally add value to it. It may not be necessary, and you may not get a dollar-for-dollar out of it, but it’s added value nonetheless. I cook a lot, I personally would like a higher quality stove - I’ve killed one before because I (an)use the broiler a lot (it wasn’t terribly old), but I probably would do an NXR or something. maybe in the $2k. Or a used Wolf/v…
In my area, if I were to spend $50k renovating my home, the value would increase by approximately $0.
If I were to spend $300k renovating my home, the value would increase by approximately $100k.
The only real increase in home value comes from additions which add bedrooms. If I were to spend money converting an attic, a basement, or adding an add-on, I'd probably come out even at the sale.
And renovations are quickly depreciating assets. I'm much better off doing that right before a sale. A new dishwasher will be an old dishwasher before too long.
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#368Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Instead, they get slightly pitying looks from coworkers, which make them feel slightly inferior and ashamed, which makes them not do it again. No they don't! Is my point. This is almost entirely a story made up by this bizarro world of smart people who think themselves into circles (and aren't working at pizza hut). Nobody cares how someone gets themselves to their job at pizza hut; the other people working there a…
Check out the song "No Scrubs" by TLC for another angle on the same topic. It's a real phenomenon, not just something made up by nerds on substack. Some people are blissfully checked out enough from social competition dynamics that they don't notice it.
Riding your bike to work (what OP is talking about) and not having a car to pick up your date (what TLC were singing about) are two pretty different things. Coworkers don't care how you get to work. Dates care bacause they don't want to have to take the bus home afterwards.
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#369Earlier quoted context omitted.
Technically a Rolex, however expensive, will always be much worse as a watch than a 20$ Casio. But recently there's another aspect to this: there are now watches that are technically (mechanically) identical to rolexes. Same design, same mechanics, virtually impossible to tell the difference when you tear it apart. Rolex has always been more about marketing (artificial scarcity, waiting list etc) than mechanics, but…
What’s an example of a watch that’s mechanically identical to a Rolex?
Tudor, but it is a different division of Rolex
Re: Be wary of imitating high-status people who can afford to countersignal
#370Earlier quoted context omitted.
Most of this is unconscious for the general population, the consequence of mimicry + social cues + emotional rewards. The person who shows up to Pizza Hut on a bicycle isn't thinking about social status consciously. Instead, they get slightly pitying looks from coworkers, which make them feel slightly inferior and ashamed, which makes them not do it again. The top executive who shows up on a bicycle gets no such feed…
> The person who shows up to Pizza Hut on a bicycle isn't thinking about social status consciously. Instead, they get slightly pitying looks from coworkers, which make them feel slightly inferior and ashamed, which makes them not do it again This is not how social dynamic at Pizza Hut works.
Yeah, I feel like some of these commenters have never worked a minumum wage job in their lives.