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Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

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Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#41

Post by MandieD »

14 wrote: post #33
WirelessGigabit wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having done 250kmph / 155mph on the German Autobahn I do wonder what why you feel like you should take the pleasure away from other people because you had a kid? No-one forces you to drive faster (1) and when driving you can stick to the right lane (2) and check your mirrors when you need to pass (3).

When I ride my motorbike it rides comfortably at about 160km/hr. For that bike it is a very comfortable speed the bike likes. If I want to rip it can do 180plus. It maxes out at 200km/hr. Even at 200 really isn’t that fast for the open highways where I live. But a huge majority of the driver population has a hard time driving at sub 80km/hr speeds so we kind of need to adjust for the lowest denominator. I think the b…

How would you enforce per-driver speed limits? As it stands, car insurance sort-of does this: German policies usually reserve the right to refuse payment if you’re at fault and were going more than 130.

How could this be managed for all the non-German vehicles that pass through? How invasive would this be?

As a sibling comment said, the difference in speed is what makes for the danger, and the driver who stays well under 130 because he feels that’s safer for him and everyone around might be less-prepared to deal with you popping up at 200 as he’s trying to pass a truck lumbering along at 80.

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#42

Post by rsj_hn »

ziml77 wrote: post #36

"Fatalities per 1,000 kilometers of motorway" That doesn't seem like a very good metric to me. There's no way there's any single number that can properly compare driving deaths between countries, but shouldn't this at least be normalized to account for number of drivers? Like what if Finland just has a lot of long, empty roads? Also doesn't there need to be a comparison within the German data on deaths on roads with…

Fatalities should be measured in terms of miles travelled. Not per mile of highway, or per number of cars, or per capita. Someone who drives five days a week, 60 miles per day is going to have a higher risk of getting into an accident that someone who drives only on weekends, 30 miles per day. This does have any bearing on how safe the roads are.

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#43

Post by bionade24 »

justapassenger wrote: post #29

Speed doesn't kill, speed differential does. Any road where you have a big differential between speeds by various road users is just inherently dangerous. If everyone would be doing 250km/h, it'd be safe. Same if everyone would be doing 120km/h. But when you mix 250 and 120 on the same road, it's inherently dangerous.

I agree, and if we had decided to create an autonomous car only line where the speed gets controlled by a central computer, this would apply. You still shouldn't ignore that the higher the speed, the more likely larger speed differences can appear. At some point external force will slow down cars significantly faster than the brake of the vehicle behind.

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#44

Post by est31 »

WirelessGigabit wrote: post #13

Myth #1: is a non-reason to ban it. Non-usage of something is not a reason to get rid of something Myth #2: I've never met someone who is like: oh if I cannot drive 200kmph I'll be late to my meeting. That's not why people drive fast. They do because it's fun! Myth #3: Emissions are taxed. Car consumes more, so you pay more taxes. Myth #4: You cannot push everybody to electric cars and then yell: oh but the electrici…

> which part of the fatalities happened > 130kmph?

Usually (not always) you realize that something bad is going to happen so you are going to brake. Let's assume there is an obstacle in front of you that is 150m away. After a reaction time of 1 second, and with continuous braking over 100m you are able to get from 180kmh to 100kmh at time of impact, but if you had started from the generally suggested 130kmh, you would have stopped 40m before the target (assuming -8.83m/s^2 braking acceleration).

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#45

Post by [deleted] »

ziml77 wrote: post #36

"Fatalities per 1,000 kilometers of motorway" That doesn't seem like a very good metric to me. There's no way there's any single number that can properly compare driving deaths between countries, but shouldn't this at least be normalized to account for number of drivers? Like what if Finland just has a lot of long, empty roads? Also doesn't there need to be a comparison within the German data on deaths on roads with…

[deleted]

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#46

Post by _0w8t »

I drove through Germany few times. While there were mostly no speed limits on Autobahns, the were a lot of “repairs” when halve of the road was closed and another was converted into 2-way road with a speed limit of 60-70 km/hour and very narrow lines. And then such section can last for 10-20 kilometers with zero activity besides couple of spots. I have never experienced such way to do repairs in Denmark, France, Italy or Spain.

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#47

Post by bluecalm »

WirelessGigabit wrote: post #13

Myth #1: is a non-reason to ban it. Non-usage of something is not a reason to get rid of something Myth #2: I've never met someone who is like: oh if I cannot drive 200kmph I'll be late to my meeting. That's not why people drive fast. They do because it's fun! Myth #3: Emissions are taxed. Car consumes more, so you pay more taxes. Myth #4: You cannot push everybody to electric cars and then yell: oh but the electrici…

Emissions are not taxed anywhere close to the cost of damage they cause. Electric cars still pollute (tires and brake pads).

In general cars and car infrastructure is very heavily subsidized and the least we should expect for it is drivers not engaging in wasteful and dangerous behaviors.

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#48

Post by outworlder »

> Myth #4: The climate impact of speeding is obsolete with electric cars

LOL. Some myths may be tricky to debunk, but it's hilarious that this one even got to that stage.

People don't notice the fuel needle going down as much on ICE vehicles (they may notice their gas bill at the end of the month to have been substantially higher). But EVs have much more precise energy meters and people do notice a massive range reduction at higher speeds. The difference between 60Mph and 70Mph is massive.

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#49

Post by boppo1 »

jstrong wrote: post #30

the trend of having every aspect of life scrutinized for its worthiness by environmentalists is getting pretty tedious. octoberfest causes emissions, too. so do birthday parties, and weddings. are we sure those should make the cut?

Yeah, these people need to read Chicken Little. And before any of you jump in to insist it is indeed falling, please consider the following: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/05/opinion/climate-change-sh....

Re: Debunking common myths about the Autobahn

#50

Post by sokoloff »

mqus wrote: post #18
aksss wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those sound like rational concerns to me.

maybe rational, but purely subjective. "Restricting freedom" - the "freedom" to reach your destination in an arbitrary speed? what kind of freedom is this? esp if we talk about a difference of what, 10 minutes over 2 hours of driving time? "potentially potentially taking away a right people are used to" it wasn't really a right (=set in law), it just was not forbidden, just like a lot of other things that get restric…

For 260 km of Autobahn driving, 130 kph results in 2 hours for that distance. Even a mere 160 kph (~100 mph) saves 22.5 minutes rather than the 10 minutes you're suggesting.
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