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No one wants to have kids anymore

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Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#391
post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everyone seems to think there are a million qualifications they have to meet before becoming a parent. "We need to have a house, and 100k in savings, etc etc etc." And yes, it's good to be prepared. But also, as long as you're a semi functional human, you'll make it work. Very true. I didn’t have my own place to live or any money when the first one was on the way. In fact, my kids are the reason I started a new car…

> Like the parent post says, you make it work. What does make it work mean? Most people I know will not accept the child “surviving” as making it work.

It just means what it means, I guess. You do the best you can to provide a good life for your child by whatever means are available to you. Sometimes you have to make compromises - even painful compromises.

Maybe you are living paycheck to paycheck so you don't buy the new game this week. You play an old game that you already had.

Maybe some mornings you have to give them a bowl of cereal instead of making eggs, because you don't have enough time.

Maybe some afternoon when everyone is exhausted from working, you let the kids play the tablets for 2 hours instead of 30 minutes like they're supposed to.

Maybe instead of renting out the trampoline park for the birthday party, you get a pavilion at your local nature park.

Maybe your kid might get a "cheese sandwich" in their lunch because you were out of turkey and didn't realize it until 11pm.

Maybe your kid desperately wants a dog, but your current living situation doesn't allow it and he has to go without.

Obviously we all want what's best for our children all the time, but life is full of compromises. I'm not saying that parents shouldn't do everything within their power to provide the best life possible for their kids - in fact, I think that's exactly the moral duty of parenthood. But there are many degrees of happiness between "pure utopian bliss" and "mere survival." And so many potential parents these days seem to think that if they can't do it absolutely perfectly then it's not worth doing.

Maybe this is just my own background, but I can't think of a single person I know whose childhood was perfectly ideal.

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Like the parent post says, you make it work. What does make it work mean? Most people I know will not accept the child “surviving” as making it work.

It just means what it means, I guess. You do the best you can to provide a good life for your child by whatever means are available to you. Sometimes you have to make compromises - even painful compromises. Maybe you are living paycheck to paycheck so you don't buy the new game this week. You play an old game that you already had. Maybe some mornings you have to give them a bowl of cereal instead of making eggs, beca…

> But there are many degrees of happiness between "pure utopian bliss" and "mere survival." And so many potential parents these days seem to think that if they can't do it absolutely perfectly then it's not worth doing.

Where does being able to afford routine healthcare land? And I do not mean waiting in the few overcrowded clinics that take Medicaid because Medicaid reimbursed very poorly so providers do not accept it.

The only difference between now and before is that now we have very effective birth control. I think it is perfectly reasonable for people to say, for example, I am not likely to be able to pay for a child’s healthcare, and so it is not worth it for me to have children (yet). Or a home in a decent school, where the other kids are not likely to be in gangs. And so on and so forth.

My parents were poor, and I never received any healthcare as a child. My dad told me to play carefully, otherwise any injuries I incurred could derail the family. I also went to a different school in different states every year until high school. So I was fed and sheltered. But would I have kids if I predicted that is what their life would be? Hell no.

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#393

One morning last week, I’ve noticed that my wife was walking around the house in unusual silence. I thought I might have upset her with something, but couldn’t really recall any transgression that would have made her mad. Then after a few minutes of this, she dropped a pregnancy test in front of me, with a “+” sign shown on the little display. Looks like I’m going to be a father! I knew that this could happen sooner…

Ketamine, psilocybin, and therapy have all made me a much better father, FWIW.

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this satire? I have a child and the monotonous boredom of dealing with a toddler forces me to suppress the distant memories of freedom to go to raves, fight in foreign militia, get lost in stormy mountains, hitchhike across the plains...

I’ve put in some effort to identify things my toddler and I can do together that we both enjoy. Here’s some in random order: - go to beach, play in sand & swim in ocean, find other kids to play with - go to woods, walk around and spot wildlife - go to farmer’s market, try various foods/drinks, play with other kids - go out for ice cream - go to playground, play with other kids - go out for some (light) off-roading, h…

Great list! For mine (2.5YO) I'll add:

- go to the library and pick out books

- go grocery shopping, discuss what foods we like/don't like, practice remembering something I'm supposed to get

- play with model trains and make up Thomas stories

- go to the aquarium store and talk about the fish

- go to the park (One time we stopped on the way for fast food and ate it at the park, which was fun, but it created an expectation for a while that there would always be chicken and fries at the park.)

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#395

> But deep down I get it. Babies are a huge opportunity cost. Financially speaking, they are like winning the lottery but backwards. You can't even think of having one without cancelling your subscription to a good night's sleep. And if you take into account inflation, economic recession, and the rest of the news cycle's highlight reel, even a one-child family can seem to have one too many mouths to fish Lego pieces…

Getting kids is the best retirement investment that you can do, because they will be there to help you when your physical and mental state will start to degrade.

They will be the ones taking you to doctor for visits, the ones that will keep you from getting scammed from your retirement money, and in general they will help you navigate the future society that will be much different from the current. So even if you hate them, kids is an investment worth considering.

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#396

A word of advice to anyone on the fence about having kids: There’s nothing wrong with choosing not to have kids, but do yourself and consult with actual parents for what it’s really like to have kids. Articles like this one, which are written by someone who apparently has chosen not to have children, are almost universally terrible at representing the true experience of being a parent. Yes, being a parent involves a…

Having a kid is the most fun I’ve ever had. Used to go to raves, done bunch of crazy sexual stuff, as well as most drugs under the sun. There’s nothing close to chasing a toddler in a circle for an hour.

I have a video recording of one irrationally happy time, I recorded it because I had a nifty new camera that could do it... the subject... me and my daughter in her car seat, waiting for my Wife to do some shopping.

It's simply half an hour of "Where's Daddy?... oh oh... There's Daddy... " peek-a-bo with laughter all around.

That was an insanely happy time. There's been lots of other fun, but that was peak pure bliss.

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a kid is the most fun I’ve ever had. Used to go to raves, done bunch of crazy sexual stuff, as well as most drugs under the sun. There’s nothing close to chasing a toddler in a circle for an hour.

Complete disagreement. Toddlers were completely uninteresting to me, nothing but hassle and pain and sorrow. Around 6 years old they get much more interesting and less awful to deal with. My wife feels the same way.

Same here. On Friday afternoon I'm already looking forward to Monday. I'm ok to play with a toddler for couple o hours, but entertaining a small but very active child for two days is really exhausting. I wish day care was opened on the weekends too, at least for few hours.

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a kid is the most fun I’ve ever had. Used to go to raves, done bunch of crazy sexual stuff, as well as most drugs under the sun. There’s nothing close to chasing a toddler in a circle for an hour.

I have a video recording of one irrationally happy time, I recorded it because I had a nifty new camera that could do it... the subject... me and my daughter in her car seat, waiting for my Wife to do some shopping. It's simply half an hour of "Where's Daddy?... oh oh... There's Daddy... " peek-a-bo with laughter all around. That was an insanely happy time. There's been lots of other fun, but that was peak pure bliss…

[deleted]

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>That's not true. Our families may be away most of the time, but we have a constant rotation of our parents (and my wife's Giagia) coming to stay with us. When our second kid was born, I don't think we were by ourselves for the first six months. Even today, we get someone visiting us at least every other month. That is not possible for many others.

Then the question is why ? What is dysfunctional about their lives that makes it impossible?

Why do you assume "dysfunctional"? Flying costs money. Having apartment big enough to accommodate 3 adults plus one or two kids costs money. Family members have to work too. There is no black and white here.

Re: No one wants to have kids anymore

#400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Real parents consistently make it clear how terrible having kids is. The childless among us hear every complaint and lament about how terrible it is. Why would we do that to ourselves?

My wife had a friend who would watch us deal with our then toddler son and claim that we were the best birth control she could wish for :-)

I wish my sister had a child first. I would have never agreed to have one on my own :D
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