"flatline" at 10 billion. I think we can make that work.
No one wants to have kids anymore
321–330 of 457 posts
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#322Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Oh and that I'll have a partner who will stay healthy (and loyal)... The LVB (lowest viable bar) is "will I be able to have a civil conversation with this person about our child whenever needed, for at least 20 years?" People get so bitterly disappointed when "unconditional love" doesn't happen, they can't even meet the LVB. Keep LVB front and center when evaluating a potential mate. If the answer is "yes, no matte…
> If the answer is "yes, no matter what happens, we can always be civil about the children I agree with you, although that's necessary but not sufficient. Having children isn't so wonderful that I'd put up for decades with a miserable relationship with my partner in the endeavor. With children in the mix, especially unhealthy children who require special support, you can't just say "looks like we've grown apart and c…
> Having children isn't so wonderful that I'd put up for decades with a miserable relationship with my partner in the endeavor.
Agreed, but that's not what I said nor even implied. If you're insisting on staying together for decades, and happily so to boot, that is a very high bar indeed. Such a high bar that only very few couples manage it. Few couples even manage the LVB.
No. If you want to have kids, you have to know that even if you divorce, even horribly, even catastrophically, that you can have a civil conversation as needed about the child for at least 20 years. If you're not sure, don't do it. Do not have a child. Spare the children and the world your children.
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#323Earlier quoted context omitted.
Including his own children being empty and sad if they don't deliver him grandchildren. That's just terrible parenting, to be so judgemental and demeaning of your own children. Edit: Then address my question instead of ignoring it. Why by your own judgemental attitude would your own children be any less empty and sad than anyone else if they chose not to reproduce themselves? And how are you not being a bad judgement…
Nice straw man you have built here. I did not answer your question because it is absurd. There is a difference between having an opinion and forcing that opinion on others. My children are their own people and they are allowed to disagree and I will not hold it against them. Because I love them more than they can understand until they have children themselves. I however hope they will be confident and flexible in the…
I'm not sure "I respect your decision to have a sad and empty life" is as wonderful a parenting statement as you seem to think it is.
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#324Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ever talked with someone looking to hire? How often have you heard "I just need to hire someone with a degree and ". My university degree is not in tech at all, but it sure has managed to open enough doors to make my self-learned skillset profitable. Pretending that people were making bad decisions with going to college is victim-blaming - there isn't a job market out there which doesn't demand a degree, pretty much…
There are good cheap unis and community colleges whose quality is not bad and which cost a whole lot less. I’d like to see those utilized more
My friends that stuck it out in community college near us were on the 5 year plan. 5 years until they had enough credits to transfer to a CSU. A lot of the courses were remedial to catch people up and the college track classes filled up instantly with people that had been in the school for years getting priority. If you came out of high school at a college level, you competed with all of the people that had taken 2-3 years of catch up courses and they got the spots.
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#325Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Unless both parents come from a really dysfunctional family, this should never be the case. Why? Many people immigrate away from their families for a variety of reasons other than them being “dysfunctional”. For example, economic opportunities. I know a quite a few couples that moved from places with low economic opportunities to places with better opportunities, and one of the downsides is that they have to navigat…
I'm from Brazil, my wife is from Greece. We are both living in Germany. So I'm well aware of what you are talking about. Yet: > one of the downsides is that they have to navigate parenting by themselves. That's not true. Our families may be away most of the time, but we have a constant rotation of our parents (and my wife's Giagia) coming to stay with us. When our second kid was born, I don't think we were by ourselv…
>That's not true. Our families may be away most of the time, but we have a constant rotation of our parents (and my wife's Giagia) coming to stay with us. When our second kid was born, I don't think we were by ourselves for the first six months. Even today, we get someone visiting us at least every other month.
That is not possible for many others.
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#326Earlier quoted context omitted.
Real parent, here. Having a son anchored me to the (land and planet)* in a very unexpected way. Formerly, there was always an option to chuck things and go somewhere else, but now whatever is in front of me I must deal with and make happen. It's not about what I want to do any more, but the first underlying thought behind everything I do is how it will affect my son and family. Lots of former options are closed. I ca…
Hmmmm... not exactly an endorsement for parenting...
Wasn't trying to endorse it. In fact, I explicitly said it's not for everyone.
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#327Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm from Brazil, my wife is from Greece. We are both living in Germany. So I'm well aware of what you are talking about. Yet: > one of the downsides is that they have to navigate parenting by themselves. That's not true. Our families may be away most of the time, but we have a constant rotation of our parents (and my wife's Giagia) coming to stay with us. When our second kid was born, I don't think we were by ourselv…
>That's not true. Our families may be away most of the time, but we have a constant rotation of our parents (and my wife's Giagia) coming to stay with us. When our second kid was born, I don't think we were by ourselves for the first six months. Even today, we get someone visiting us at least every other month. That is not possible for many others.
Then the question is why? What is dysfunctional about their lives that makes it impossible?
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#328Earlier quoted context omitted.
For the vast majority of people, the diaper phase is temporary. Sure, but it is far from a guarantee. And you should at least be aware of that.
I guess. What is the percentage of people who have to wear diapers their whole life? I don't know but it has to be a small fraction of a percent.
> I guess.
You guess what? That potential parents should be prepared to take care of their children for their entire life? I think that's reasonable. Things happen all the time, too, where tragedies happen and people suffer medical issues that require lifetime care.
Being a parent is committing to that.
And if your thought is "I'm going to gamble that it doesn't happen to me" is really telling.
Regardless, being informed is important. Maybe you got lucky in your ignorance, but not everyone will be so lucky.
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#329Earlier quoted context omitted.
I like RMS being out there and having the opinions he does, but please don't act like he is some great role model for men or humans. He's a weird nerd who doesn't attract mates and alienates his allies. Woe be unto any man who tries to be like him, you'll end up unhappy and considered a loser
Where did you get that I was acting like he is some great role model? If you read the entire thread, you will see that I made fun of him 29 years ago by feeding his own words into his own psychiatric diagnosis program (Emacs Doctor), which recognized his name, and criticized him for having hangups and inhibitions. My point was that in spite of his acerbic but hilarious biting sense of humor, he has a valid point abou…
Fair, I think I read more into your comment than was warranted
Re: No one wants to have kids anymore
#330Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is sort of funny how any anti-natalist political position will get outbred out of existence haha. Reminds me of the Shakers who kind of died off because their belief system prevented procreation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shakers
If that were true, birth rates wouldn't be declining in so many places. Any rational assessment would realize the correlation has nothing at all to do with genetics.
I wasn't blaming people's attitudes for the birth rate, just making observation about how any anti-natalist memes are likely fighting an uphill battle to propagate compared to memes that will get passed from parent to child