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Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

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Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#401

Post by rodent_rodeo »

TheBlerch wrote: post #367
bootlooped wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use a similar setup just for near my cat litter box. Almost totally eliminates pet smell. I have an AC Infinity fan I really like, it's very quiet on the lowest 3 of 8 speeds. The filter is just some generic brand. I never want to own pets without this level of air filtration again.

No offense intended, but the best way to reduce any potential odors from your cat’s box is simply to pick it up regularly. Several times per day when my partner or I pass the box we scoop it and place the waste in a sealed bag in a sealed bucket. Takes 30 seconds. Never had issues with odors and the cats appreciate a clean box, just as any person appreciates a clean bathroom (more so for cats with their stronger sens…

Counter point: I don’t eat raw uncooked mice nor lick my excrement shoot. Then again maybe it’s because I have unrefined country barn cats who are lacking culture.

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#402

Post by pfdietz »

hammock wrote: post #146
pfdietz wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not sulfates, it's ethoxylated alcohols. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethoxylation

It's both, and they work the same way on the gut

That may be true, but your assertion that rinse aids have sulfates is incorrect. All the ones I've looked at have nonionic surfactants that are not sulfates.

(There are also sulfates that are aren't AES, such as sodium sulfate, which appears in many powdered dishwasher detergents. I doubt this has the same effect, so it's incorrect to just blame "sulfates".)

I think you need to learn the gloriously liberating feeling of admitting you were wrong.

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#403

Post by hanafudafan »

htoiwuerweoir23 wrote: post #234

Why is anyone surprised by any of this ? I don't mean to sound like a pleb, but the biggest lesson of the past two centuries is how much people bluff, use the name of 'science, progress, blah blah' to push for their own profits, regardless of actual consequences (bodily or environmentally or ecologically). I generally stick to old-school goods that are totally natural, cheap and are still massively produced in India.…

Nobody in this thread is expressing any surprise or shock. It's perfectly sensible that incredibly penetrating and dispersing engineered surfactants would damage a biological organism. It's the most natural thing in the world and I doubt anybody would feel surprise or shock when hearing that yet another engineered synthetic lifestyle substance is bad for you.

On the other hand if we were to learn that these synthesized products were actually good for you that would be surprising.

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#404

Post by jamal-kumar »

kragen wrote: post #204
jamal-kumar wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best part is all SLS does is contribute to the foaming of the toothpaste, that's literally all it does (Same thing in soap). It's just to give some psychological idea that foamy toothpaste cleans better. Something like a focus group in the 1950s came up with this ingredient.

no it's a surfactant surfactants emulsify lipids in polar liquids like water such emulsification is crucial to many kinds of cleaning because cell membranes are lipid bilayers surfactants also can cause cytolysis, maybe relevant if you're trying to get bacterial films off your teeth, and sds is commonly used for this in bio labs surfactants also often foam but this is irrelevant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_d…

I could imagine there's better surfactants than that out there, you sound correct and now i feel my dentist is full of lies

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#405

Post by kragen »

jamal-kumar wrote: post #404
kragen wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no it's a surfactant surfactants emulsify lipids in polar liquids like water such emulsification is crucial to many kinds of cleaning because cell membranes are lipid bilayers surfactants also can cause cytolysis, maybe relevant if you're trying to get bacterial films off your teeth, and sds is commonly used for this in bio labs surfactants also often foam but this is irrelevant https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_d…

I could imagine there's better surfactants than that out there, you sound correct and now i feel my dentist is full of lies

research papers in biomedical fields often drip with disdain for 'practitioners' (doctors, dentists, nurses, etc.) because their knowledge of chemistry, epidemiology, genomics, etc., is so limited and often wrong

i'd like to see one of those statisticians save an abscessed motherfucking molar though

anyway your dentist is probably not actually being bribed by tom's of maine, he just knows a lot of his patients had less canker sores when they stopped using toothpaste with dish detergent in it

because guess what else has cell membranes

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#406

Post by fooblaster »

runnerup wrote: post #235
germinalphrase wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you use the carbon scrubbers in-line with your HVAC or did you rig of some kind of stand alone system?

Stand-alone. I got two cylindrical carbon filters and one fan. I slide the three components together and then stand them up vertically like a floor standing speaker. Currently living in an apartment. It scrubs the air really quite fast. Helps a lot with kitchen smoke, pet smells, cleaning chemical vapors, and new furniture/plastic VOCs. I also live in the middle of a bunch of chemical plants so it’s invaluable for th…

I think I'm going to try this. A little concerned about the wobbly-ness of the vertical stack of all of these given the weight of the filters. Seems like all these systems are intended to be ceiling mounted to grow tents. Wish there was a nice metal frame that could be used to floor-mount this setup a little more elegantly.

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#407

Post by saaaaaam »

herbst wrote: post #269
Vrondi wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently in Europe and some other countries they don't do whole house water softeners?

Interestingly enough as normal as salt containers are in dishwashers as 'uncommon' are house wide water softeners to me. I know a few people who have a single outlet for osmosis water, I use a optional water filter in the kitchen outlet for drinking water. But nobody I know is softening their whole water supply. Why soften toilet water? Why soften cleaning water? Garden water? Well for the last 2 I guess it depends o…

Softening toilet water means there’s less limes SLE build up in the bowl and around the rim which means the toilet is easier to clean.

Softening cleaning water means your clothes come out - well, quite literally softer. And last longer.

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#408

Post by unethical_ban »

moloch-hai wrote: post #342
hammock wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Gas stoves exhaust right into the house Best case you have a hood that vents to the outside. Hoods really work

Restaurants commonly have such hoods. I don't know of any private homes that do, though I don't doubt a few exist.

My home as a kid did. I don't know why it's fallen out of favor, since I can't imagine it costing more than $100 or so in parts and labor on a build... If we can have a bathroom vent, why not a cooking vent?

If the vent moves more than a certain amount of CFM air, then an exchange system is required, but that takes almost a restaurant grade vent to get to.

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#409

Post by forgotmypw17 »

causi wrote: post #400
forgotmypw17 wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I mentioned in another comment, the easy way to test for this is to take a freshly-dishwashed glass and fill it with water. Look for foamy bubbles that don't clear up quickly around the edge. Then rinse it thoroughly and try again. With most home dishwashers, I have seen evidence of leftovers.

It seems like the easiest solution is to just not use rinse-aid, since the study didn't seem to find any issues with regular detergent.

I'm not sure if there is any difference?

Re: Gut epithelial barrier damage caused by dishwasher detergents and rinse aids

#410

Post by causi »

forgotmypw17 wrote: post #409
causi wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like the easiest solution is to just not use rinse-aid, since the study didn't seem to find any issues with regular detergent.

I'm not sure if there is any difference?

The difference seems to be that rinse-aids cause health problems and regular detergent doesn't.
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