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Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

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Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#51

As with everything else, it seems, my anecdotal experience suggests a balance is usually the best overall answer. People with diarrhea of the mouth aren't much fun to talk to, but either are people who won't say more than three words at a time. Same with what you talk about. People like to talk about themselves, but many of them are interested in hearing about you too. Just keep it under control, and lob that convers…

Why not?

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#52
post #5

One of the often repeated pearls of wisdom from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie, is people like to talk about themselves and they’ll like you more if you let them do that in a conversation. I’m paraphrasing. This research seems to counter that. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Win_Friends_and_Influ...

> from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie Implementing the advice in this book too literally makes for very inauthentic sounding conversation. After reading this book, I found it easy to spot other people who had read it and were trying the techniques on me. For example, when someone uses my name 10 different times in a private conversation for no obvious reason, I have a good idea that they’…

Using someone's name is also a good way to make sure you remember it, though. :(

To an extent, I agree with you. That said, protocols are also not a bad thing and socializing is almost certainly a learnable skill.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#53
post #5

One of the often repeated pearls of wisdom from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie, is people like to talk about themselves and they’ll like you more if you let them do that in a conversation. I’m paraphrasing. This research seems to counter that. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Win_Friends_and_Influ...

> from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie Implementing the advice in this book too literally makes for very inauthentic sounding conversation. After reading this book, I found it easy to spot other people who had read it and were trying the techniques on me. For example, when someone uses my name 10 different times in a private conversation for no obvious reason, I have a good idea that they’…

IMO the book itself addressed that point by suggesting that you try to find something to genuinely like about each person you engage with. The formulaic approach isn't meant to be the end goal, it's just a way to go from zero to some sort of common ground, from which a genuine connection can develop. It's really helpful for people who are totally inept at human conversation (like me) but it's just a starting place.

Nonviolent comms is similar... techniques for lowering people's defensiveness upfront and finding connection so that you can actually move forward with discussing the meat of the issue instead of being caught up in mutual dislike based on first impressions and preexisting biases.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#54
post #5

One of the often repeated pearls of wisdom from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie, is people like to talk about themselves and they’ll like you more if you let them do that in a conversation. I’m paraphrasing. This research seems to counter that. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Win_Friends_and_Influ...

I think it highly depends on with whom you are conversing. Extraverts, well, some of them probably could chit-chat with a telephone pole. After working myself out of elective mutism as a teen, I realized I had gotten very physically expressive as a kind of adaptation. As an adult, I invented a slightly cruel game wherein, should I get snagged by one of these kinds of extraverts, I wouldn't say any words, merely react with my face, gestures, postures, that kind of thing. Little nods. The idea was to see how long they would go on talking without any input from me.

Some were of the opinion that I was a good conversationalist, which I find darkly amusing.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#55

"Some people find some other people more likable when those people speak more in a conversation, but drawing any other conclusions than that would be fantastically stupid on its own merits, and doubly so given the recent crises in this field." There, I fixed it for you.

I certainly wouldn't assume a linear relationship between talking time and likeability. There has to be a drop-off at some point, since few people like being ambushed by someone who won't let them say a single word. Familiarity also plays a role. It might be somewhat relieving for a new acquaintance to carry a conversation, but wearying for a familiar person to subject you to endless verbal barrages.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#56
post #5

One of the often repeated pearls of wisdom from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie, is people like to talk about themselves and they’ll like you more if you let them do that in a conversation. I’m paraphrasing. This research seems to counter that. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Win_Friends_and_Influ...

I talk with a few too many people who take the "let other people talk about themselves" rule as gospel. While it's nice to be given the spotlight, the point of a conversation is that it's an exchange, not a soliloquy. Conversations with people who listen a lot and don't give a lot back start to feel a bit uncomfortable as well.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#57
Just a side note, something I've been using lately to monitor how much I talk in meetings is something called Read.ai - https://www.read.ai/

There's a bunch of other neat features, but monitoring talk time is what I use the most. It works in real-time as a bot on Google meet and Zoom (the two platforms I use). I believe it should work on other video platforms as well. Just sign up and it'll start joining meetings on your calendar (if you provide it access).

Instead of using the idea everyone should have equal talk time. It depends on a meeting type. For instance, in meetings with clients or during interviews, I want to let them out talk me. "Tell me about yourself", etc. Obviously during presentations I would like to talk more, etc.

Even in this study they are targeting only one particular conversation type. It seems obvious if you try to be the most relatable and interesting, people will favor you... But that's not every conversation. That wouldn't be the case if we're all engineers trying to build a bridge.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#58

Just a side note, something I've been using lately to monitor how much I talk in meetings is something called Read.ai - https://www.read.ai/ There's a bunch of other neat features, but monitoring talk time is what I use the most. It works in real-time as a bot on Google meet and Zoom (the two platforms I use). I believe it should work on other video platforms as well. Just sign up and it'll start joining meetings on…

wow, that sounds dangerous and an active security risk to any company or individual who did not consent to it and counter intuitive to really anything meaningful at all. The organization that came up with this idea probably is raking it selling other company data to third party organizations and governments. This itself looks like an ad.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#59
To be clear... this study is ONLY about an initial TWELVE MINUTES of conversation with a STRANGER.

And so the idea that "the more you talk, the more someone will like you" should be extrapolated to e.g. an entire two-hour first date, or to existing relationships at home or at work or with friends, would obviously be nonsense.

It certainly is an interesting finding, and easy to understand in retrospect -- people can decide to like you and find you more interesting if they've heard you speak for 8.4 minutes as opposed to 3.6 minutes.

But I wouldn't take this as any kind of generalized advice about "how much to talk in conversations", as the title suggests. The title is, frankly, a horrifying example of taking a small interesting finding and falsely suggesting it's much more broadly applicable.

Re: Mistaken beliefs about how much to talk in conversations

#60
post #5

One of the often repeated pearls of wisdom from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie, is people like to talk about themselves and they’ll like you more if you let them do that in a conversation. I’m paraphrasing. This research seems to counter that. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Win_Friends_and_Influ...

> from How to Win Friends and Influence People[0] by Dale Carnegie Implementing the advice in this book too literally makes for very inauthentic sounding conversation. After reading this book, I found it easy to spot other people who had read it and were trying the techniques on me. For example, when someone uses my name 10 different times in a private conversation for no obvious reason, I have a good idea that they’…

Mentioning the other persons name is also a trick to remember it, perhaps that’s why they repeat it.
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