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Brave launches private search ads

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Re: Brave launches private search ads

#281

Post by DavideNL »

AraceliHarker wrote: post #243

I think Brave Ads is sophomoric to say that they don't track users when Apple, not to mention Facebook and Google, understand that the effective operation of Internet advertising is to track users. Blocking other companies' ads and posting their own ads instead is unbecoming and also reminds me of AdBlock Plus.

The big difference to me seems that Brave actually gives you the possibility to pay them, instead of showing you ads and tracking you.

None of the other Big Tech companies do this.

Seems quite reasonable! in the end someone has to pay the bills after all...

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#282

Post by DavideNL »

INeedMoreRam wrote: post #48
mberning wrote: post #32

I have been enjoying Kagi. Don’t mind the $10 per month to support something that caters to me rather than advertisers.

Did you create a new “bogus”email address when you signed up for their service to hide your identity? Or were you okay with giving them your real email address? I feel uncomfortable potentially having my searches linked to my real email and/or name.

Your e-mail address is not relevant; You can be tracked anyway, by browser fingerprinting, etc.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#283

Post by logicalmonster »

ohgodplsno wrote: post #268
logicalmonster wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After all the Brave controversies "Brave's controversies" are not really about Brave. Brave as a company is not above criticism and should be harshly gone after for their mistakes when they do anything less than perfect with regards to privacy or anything else. I think they've done over 90% of things right, but have screwed up a small portion of the complicated stuff (new browser, new online advertising models, and…

>A certain crowd will not give Eich an inch to ever succeed and will continuously rip even the most minor and inane issue solely to destroy what he represents. Oh fuck off. To add on to the comments of others, Many of us _do_ care about his "political beliefs". If you're in the tech industry, you're in one of the most queer industries of all time, and some (and sometimes, many depending on where you are) of your coll…

A demonstration of my exact point couldn't be made clearer than your comment. Thank you.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#284

Post by slenk »

SebastianKra wrote: post #169
squeaky-clean wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I sat down with a troubled couple who was having a hard time communicating, I wouldn't periodically interrupt and say "let's pause a moment for an ad. I think that's going to really open up a better and more free exchange between the both of you." Couples counseling isn't free, maybe with ads they could be. I mean obviously not, but only because a professional counselor can only see about 8 couples per day while…

I hate that ads are now seen as a necessary evil for funding free access to services. The money still comes from you, just through the purchase of products. What's worse, if you pay for YouTube Premium or Kagi, you're effectively paying for your content twice. No wonder, poorer people can't afford that. I guess you could frame it like this: "Company are overcharging us by insane amounts anyways, so at least some of t…

Wait - I pay for YT Premium and see ZERO ads on YouYube. How exactly am I paying for my content twice?

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#285

Post by ipaddr »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #150
ipaddr wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there? You are searching for keywords and paid information is presented usually in some order that puts paid items near the top and more visible.

But i'm searching for a sharpener, not a tree cutting service. When I open youtube and click on the chainsaw sharpening tutorial video, i wasnt to see that video, not 6 ads for something i didn't search for and don't need.

You wanted to see Golden Girls but they showed you ads on teeth glue before your program started?

That is to be expected. You might not need it but someone thought enough viewers would to make it profitable

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#286

Post by BrendanEich »

nroach wrote: post #209
BrendanEich wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks, you have a point. This sentence is trying to get across two separate ideas without doing the work, and its breezy style doesn't help. 1. Ad-free premium search is already an option with Brave Search, and the ads in the free leg we just launched are privacy-preserving, but none of this proves the "free and open exchange" claim. The "free" part was intended to mean no-payment-required, because many can't afford…

> Ad-free premium search is already an option with Brave Search Is the premium search ad-free in the sense that no user-derived data is utilized or extractable for advertising purposes? Or is it ad free in the sense that no ads are displayed to premium tier users, but user data can still be an input for ad measurement, conversion, and modeling?

Brave search is private in no-user-identification and no-reidentification-via-record-unlinkability senses always, both legs: we do not build user profiles. As with all engines, we learn from head of query log and what link is clicked. That is an essential first party purpose, but we collect no personal data because nothing is linkable across queries and clicks to any person.

If you opt into the Web Discovery Project (it's off by default and a separate setting; only in Brave), then your queries and clicks across all navigation are turned into anonymous data by dropping any with enough entropy to suspect they bear personal data, dropping IP and headers, and otherwise ensuring record-unlinkability. See

https://support.brave.com/hc/en-us/articles/4409406835469-Wh...

and

https://github.com/brave/web-discovery-project/blob/main/mod....

Because Premium Brave Search has no ads, it's not useful _per se_ for ad measurement, conversion, or modeling. But I took your question do mean "do premium search queries and outbound link clicks feed into the search engine?" -- they do. But no ads, and no way to model directly how an ad would perform, beyond the big data benefit that all search engine use to help ad sales and matching.

Last thing: with off-by-default (opt-in) Brave Rewards user ads (push => new tab on click), the matching agent is in the browser, inactive until opt-in, off upon opt-out, and you can clear its history. Confirmations and revenue shares via Chaumian blind signature protocol (Privacy Pass uses same crypto alg). No server-side ad matching at all. Same for Brave News (for ads and all feeds, everything).

With search ads, matching is server-side (after the edge proxy that drops IP etc.) based on only the query, device, country, and timezone. Anything more personalized, we can go to client-side matching and ad insertion. I hope this helps.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#287

Post by BrendanEich »

asadotzler wrote: post #198
hunterb123 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No they don't. They don't replace ads, that's a lie, stop repeating it here please. The Brave rewards are system OS text notifications that you can OPT IN to. In no way do they replace banner ads on websites.

Replacement doesn't imply a reuse of a specific location. Taking an ad out your browser and placing a different ad on your desktop is still replacement. Do you really not understand that advertising isn't about space in physical world, but about space in your mind? What brave does is absolutely replacement. They replace a bit of light that was emanating from one part of your device's screen to invade your attention t…

Hi Asa, macOS dictionary says

re·place /rəˈplās/

verb

1. take the place of. "Ian's smile was replaced by a frown" 2. put (something) back in a previous place or position. "he drained his glass and replaced it on the bar"

Notice the use of place and position. If you say we "replace ads", I think you are misusing the word replace. I hope you won't from here on, because we definitely still get smeared with the lie that we replace ads in-situ in publisher pages.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#288

Post by ohgodplsno »

logicalmonster wrote: post #283
ohgodplsno wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>A certain crowd will not give Eich an inch to ever succeed and will continuously rip even the most minor and inane issue solely to destroy what he represents. Oh fuck off. To add on to the comments of others, Many of us _do_ care about his "political beliefs". If you're in the tech industry, you're in one of the most queer industries of all time, and some (and sometimes, many depending on where you are) of your coll…

A demonstration of my exact point couldn't be made clearer than your comment. Thank you.

You're welcome. A clear demonstration that you are perfectly happy with people being discriminated against just because of their sexual orientation.

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#289

Post by MrMan »

encryptluks2 wrote: post #220
grammers wrote: post #137

I prefer paying for services, e.g. Tutanota, Anonaddy, Bitwarden, Guardian. Why do people take everything on the web for free? Of course, companies need to make money - if not with subs, then with ads. What else should they do?

They should put ethics before their Tesla's and summer beach houses.

its their free speech

Re: Brave launches private search ads

#290

Post by BrendanEich »

skinnymuch wrote: post #94
hunterb123 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No they don't. They don't replace ads, that's a lie, stop repeating it here please. The Brave rewards are system OS text notifications that you can OPT IN to. In no way do they replace banner ads on websites.

They could have meant when Brave swapped affiliate links before the backlash had them backtrack. Which was a wild thing to do. Blocking ads in your browser while charging to not show ads is also pretty wild. Why doesn’t their ad blocker block their ads?

You're wrong on "refgate", see https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/1360780527100338177.

We do block our own search ads if Brave Shields is set to Aggressive mode, same as with other search engines and UGC social platforms.

What else you got?

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