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Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

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Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#231

Post by wpietri »

tekla wrote: post #218
wpietri wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As somebody who has been reading it even longer, I disagree. We live in an age of increasing polarization. Asymmetric polarization, I should add; look at how the US House has changed since 1980 or so: https://xkcd.com/1127/large/ The Economist has long been attempting to straddle common political divides even as those divides grow larger. This has been causing fragmentation everywhere. Look, for example, at the Liber…

> heir "by invitation" pieces are by nature platforming people and avoiding most of their editorial standards. > I also see right-wing framings creeping into pieces more often than before. There we go, you think its worse because it doesn't 100% cater to your views.

It is true that I disagree with some of the right-wing framings, but I don't object on that account. I've never entirely agreed with The Economist, but that hasn't kept me from enjoying it and finding it useful.

But the US right has from my perspective gone insane. Take as an example the belief that Trump won the 2020 election. A majority of Republicans (and only Republicans, not independents, Democrats, or people outside the US) believe that Joe Biden did not legitimately win: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/01/07/republica...

And unfortunately, it's not confined to the US. From Boris Johnson to Jair Bolsonaro to Viktor Orban and well beyond, there are a lot of politicians on the right who you can't really call conservative in that they, like Trump, have repudiated a lot of traditional conservative values like honesty, accuracy, and integrity.

My problem is that the Economist, whose tone for me has always been one of cool reason, whose founding goal was "to take part in 'a severe contest between intelligence, which presses forward, and an unworthy, timid ignorance obstructing our progress,'" is letting the crazy leak in.

As I said, it's a hard problem to stay balanced in unbalanced times, so I have sympathy for them. But that doesn't mean I'm going to pretend the problem doesn't exist.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#232

Post by jmyeet »

FabHK wrote: post #178
jmyeet wrote: post #122

Years ago before electronic devices, The Economist was my "flight fodder" in that I only really bought a copy when I had a long flight and it was long and dense enough that I'd never get through it all. I haven't read it in awhile. It's disappointing to hear the quality has gone down (if true). You're not suggesting otherwise but I feel compelled to mention it anyway for completeness: every publication has a politica…

It's a bit more nuanced than "neoliberal, centre-right", though. The Economist is aware of the failures of markets, in favour of drug legalisation, gay marriage, gun control, measures to curb climate change (they've called for a carbon tax from 1987 onwards), and has endorsed the Democrat rather than Republican candidate in 6 of the last 8 US presidential elections.

I don’t disagree with you but consider one of your examples: the carbon tax.

This attempts to use capitalism to solve a global problem. That’s the hallmark of neoliberalism: the undying faith in capitalism or simply taking it as axiomatic.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#233

Post by civilized »

chipotle_coyote wrote: post #176
civilized wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't they ultimately publish the same stuff in both? I would definitely appreciate a quality/triviality filter though, maybe the print is the only way to get it.

I think that everything that's in print is available on the web site, but there are also web-only things, so the print magazine may be a bit of a "quality/triviality filter" in that regard. I like The Atlantic in general, although I think they have a bit of what I sometimes call a "contrarian bias", e.g., prioritizing "the conventional wisdom is X, but here's why it's wrong" think-pieces even when their theses aren't…

I think they're mostly conventional these days, but the pieces aren't that strong whether they're conventional or contrarian.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#234

Post by pjc50 »

enumjorge wrote: post #146
pjc50 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Times columnist who got cited in two mass shooter manifestos as an inspiration is still working.

Can you share more info on this? I want to read more about it, but a few google search didn't turn up anything.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/jul/25/norway-melanie... ; I believe she was also cited by the guy who shot up a mosque in New Zealand.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#235

Post by rchaud »

Wall Street Journal (except the op-ed pages, which are comically extreme). Financial Times is also very good, I prefer WSJ.

They provide actual reporting and not just narrative; WSJ reporting broke the news of the Theranos fraud for example.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#236

Post by chrchang523 »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #67
jakozaur wrote: post #22

I am long-time fun of Economist, but unfortunately the quality decreases. E.g. last issue EU is frozen and claim so many people will die in Europe due to high energy prices. First, I find they did not explain their model well. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Second, the correlation does not imply causation or whether extrapolations are solid. It looks like there might be mistakes on that front an…

Interesting, on Twitter Noah Smith has become a laughing stock. I will say that generally, non-print media like Substack, personal blogs and Twitter can be a much higher quality replacement. Requires a little digging though.

Just a personal opinion, but I'd characterize Noah Smith as "uneven", not "laughingstock". He hits enough high notes that I would be quite sad to see him go, even though I find him very unreliable.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#237

Post by davidhyde »

crazygringo wrote: post #162

I see this claim in nearly every HN thread about the Economist -- that it's declined in quality. And it baffles me because, having read it for 20+ years and gone back for research to read plenty of articles from further back... I just don't see it at all. It's the same market-based, socially progressive, pragmatic international strongly opinionated journalism it's always been. Sometimes I think the way it characteriz…

I agree that The Economist has not been declining. I believe that what is really happening is that, at some point, a reader will eventually come across an article where they are particularly knowledgable about the subject matter. To their horror, they proceed to read an article that is “fraudulent by omission”. The cherry picked facts (which are correct) are chosen to fit a narrative. Every article read after this is mired by scepticism and therefor the perceived decline of the publication. This is what happened to me back in 2015 and try as I might, I just couldn’t get back into reading that magazine. I really miss those ignorant days of blissful intellectual smugness though.

It’s like watching a movie where you only ever see the good side of the hero. Viewers do not want you to change their mind half way through or cause them to be confused by the muddy reality of things.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#238

Post by mzd348 »

Politico.eu has a weekly "print edition" (you can download the pdf from their site) and I feel it's not too far from The Economist in terms of subject matter, and goes into more depth for EU issues. The writing quality isn't as good though. Not sure what their political leaning is.

The New Statesman isn't bad but has some problems: delivery delays to the US (maybe not an issue for you) and lots of "advertorials". The writing quality is usually good. It has a left/labour leaning.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#239

Post by Manuel_D »

wpietri wrote: post #231
tekla wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> heir "by invitation" pieces are by nature platforming people and avoiding most of their editorial standards. > I also see right-wing framings creeping into pieces more often than before. There we go, you think its worse because it doesn't 100% cater to your views.

It is true that I disagree with some of the right-wing framings, but I don't object on that account. I've never entirely agreed with The Economist, but that hasn't kept me from enjoying it and finding it useful. But the US right has from my perspective gone insane. Take as an example the belief that Trump won the 2020 election. A majority of Republicans (and only Republicans, not independents, Democrats, or people ou…

The Economist has repeatedly and emphatically rejected the lie that the 2020 election was stolen. I'm really not seeing any "crazy leak in". Pretty much all "crazy" views I can think of the Economist rejects vigorously.

Re: Ask HN: Alternatives to The Economist?

#240

Post by rchaud »

jimmytidey wrote: post #155

One effect you might be experiencing is over-familiarity. I find magazines fascinating for a while, then you understand their house style, the quirks of the recurrent columns, their political stance, and you know what they are going to say even before you read. Even when they say the opposite of what you were expecting the reach their conclusion by travelling through territory you've been through many times before. W…

Interesting point, I have definitely felt that with the New York Times, especially in terms of how it covers international stories. You can see the angle a mile away. The Economist is even more guilty of this because their editorial style is pretty upfront about their ideology. Every story can be summarized as "more free trade/less regulation would have prevented $currentDisaster"
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